The New Sudoku Players' Forum

[ravel]

Yes, interesting, but what prompted you to consider that? Did it just pop out at you, or is it something you normally look for?

Mauricio had found amazing hard puzzles with full digit symmetry, and in the last hardest list(s) you can find some with "almost" digit symmetry (famous being the one found by m_b_metcalf in this thread here).

[JPF]

Summary :

Code: Select all

  ER    Player    #                                                             
                                                                               
 1.5   TTHsieh    1                                                             
 2.0     ravel    2                                                             
 2.3  Mauricio   19                                                             
 2.5  Mauricio   18                                                             
 2.6   TTHsieh    5                                                             
 2.8       JPF   11                                                             
 3.2  Mauricio   25                                                             
 4.2       JPF   12                                                             
 4.4       JPF   24                                                             
 4.5       JPF   20                                                             
 4.6       JPF   21                                                             
 5.6  Mauricio   22                                                             
 5.7  Mauricio   26                                                             
 5.8  Mauricio   23                                                             
 6.6       JPF    7                                                             
 6.7     tarek   13                                                             
 6.8   TTHsieh   28                                                             
 7.1       JPF    3                                                             
 7.2       JPF    4                                                             
 7.3   TTHsieh    6                                                             
 7.5   TTHsieh   14                                                             
 8.3   TTHsieh   27                                                             
 8.4       JPF    8                                                             
 8.5   TTHsieh   15                                                             
 8.9  Mauricio   29                                                             
 9.0   TTHsieh    9                                                             
 9.1       JPF   16                                                             
 9.2       JPF   17                                                             
 9.3  Mauricio   30                                                             
 9.6   TTHsieh   10                                                             


Current score :

Code: Select all

   Player  Points                                                               
                                                                               
 Mauricio     192                                                               
      JPF     143                                                               
  TTHsieh     125                                                               
    tarek      13                                                               
    ravel       2                                                               


JPF

[Mauricio]

There's still a 7.8 roaming around. It seems I will have tho think about a nice pattern, I didn't count on that...

[TTHsieh]

Code: Select all

 . . 3 | . . . | 7 . .
 . 5 . | . . . | . 6 .
 8 . . | . 9 . | . . 2
 - - - + - - - + - - -
 . . . | 6 . 2 | . . .
 . . 5 | . . . | 3 . .
 . . . | 5 . 7 | . . .
 - - - + - - - + - - -
 2 . . | . 4 . | . . 6
 . 7 . | . . . | . 1 .
 . . 9 | . . . | 5 . .   ER=7.8



TThsieh

[Mauricio]

Well, it seems that one week hiatus is too much for my taste. What do you think if we reduce the number of days? We can choose by general concensus to release a new pattern when it is clear that all possible ratings are exhausted (as it might be in the present pattern). What do you think? May I post the new pattern?

[ravel]

I agree to a shorter period for ending the game, i would propose 3 days. I dont know how to determine, if all possible ratings are found (except someone makes an exhaustive search, which for this pattern might be possible).

I also suggest a bonus for the last posted rating.

Look at this one as noncompetitive, i dont want to delay the start of the next game.

Code: Select all

 +-------+-------+-------+
 | . . 9 | . . . | 1 . . |
 | . 2 . | . . . | . 4 . |
 | 3 . . | . 4 . | . . 7 |
 +-------+-------+-------+
 | . . . | 2 . 6 | . . . |
 | . . 2 | . . . | 9 . . |
 | . . . | 3 . 7 | . . . |
 +-------+-------+-------+
 | 6 . . | . 5 . | . . 8 |
 | . 7 . | . . . | . 2 . |
 | . . 1 | . . . | 7 . . |
 +-------+-------+-------+ ER 3.0


[JPF]

There are still some ER to discover as the last ravel's posting proved.
What about 9.3, 9.5 for example ?
In theory, TTHsieh could still beat Mauricio's score.

So the decision to shorten this game is in TTHsieh's hands.

I also suggest a bonus for the last posted rating.

I agree on this idea.
I think also that the bonus for the highest rating is too low.

I suggest these bonuses for the next pattern :
Highest ER = +20
Latest ER = +30

The initial dealer should be given a "handicap" (-20 ?), as he gets a big advantage to propose the pattern and is in a position to start the research before anybody else.

JPF

[TTHsieh]

I suggest these bonuses for the next pattern :
Highest ER = +20
Latest ER = +30

I agree.

So the decision to shorten this game is in TTHsieh's hands.

Mauricio may start a new pattern.

TTHsieh

[JPF]

Edited : I will make a summary for the last pattern here.
Final score :

Code: Select all

   Player  Points                                                               
                                                                               
 Mauricio     192
  TTHsieh     156                                                               
      JPF     143
    ravel      44                                                               
    tarek      13                                                               


So the decision to shorten this game is in TTHsieh's hands.

Mauricio may start a new pattern.TTHsieh

OK, Maurico, it's your turn !
I hope you agree to start with a -20 penalty

JPF

[ravel]

I also agree to the bonuses and penalty. What about the ending period now ?

[TTHsieh]

What about the ending period now ?

I agree ravel's proposal : latest post + 3 days

TTHsieh

[Mauricio]

Ok, I agree with all above said.
So far now the proposed puzzles have had a low number of clues, that helps that the rule

Each posted puzzle must have a new ER and has to be minimal.

is easy to follow. For example, in the previous pattern, I found 439 essentialy different puzzles, and only 2 were non minimal. Now this will not be the case (and so ravel might have an advantage, as he has worked on the maximum number of clues puzzles).

New pattern!:

Code: Select all

#A volcano, 25 clues
+-------+-------+-------+
| . . . | . . . | . . . |
| . . 1 | 2 3 4 | 5 . . |
| . . 2 | . . . | 1 . . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| . 3 . | . . . | . 4 . |
| . 6 . | 1 7 8 | . 3 . |
| . 8 . | . . . | . 7 . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| 4 . . | . . . | . . 8 |
| 8 . . | 7 9 3 | . . 2 |
| 7 . . | . . . | . . 6 |
+-------+-------+-------+     ER 1.2


Let's see how many different difficulties can we discover. As you see, in all boxes the clues are arranged in a straight line, so I dont expect the rating to be too high, but surprisingly it was hard (for me) to too find an all singles puzzle.

[TTHsieh]

Code: Select all

 . . . | . . . | . . .
 . . 5 | 8 1 9 | 2 . .
 . . 8 | . . . | 6 . .
 - - - + - - - + - - -
 . 1 . | . . . | . 9 .
 . 4 . | 5 6 3 | . 1 .
 . 3 . | . . . | . 4 .
 - - - + - - - + - - -
 9 . . | . . . | . . 3
 3 . . | 6 7 1 | . . 8
 6 . . | . . . | . . 5   ER=1.5



Code: Select all

 . . . | . . . | . . .
 . . 5 | 8 1 9 | 2 . .
 . . 8 | . . . | 5 . .
 - - - + - - - + - - -
 . 1 . | . . . | . 9 .
 . 4 . | 5 6 3 | . 1 .
 . 3 . | . . . | . 6 .
 - - - + - - - + - - -
 9 . . | . . . | . . 3
 3 . . | 6 7 1 | . . 8
 2 . . | . . . | . . 4   ER=1.7
 


TTHsieh

[JPF]

Code: Select all

 . . . | . . . | . . .
 . . 1 | 2 3 4 | 5 . .
 . . 2 | . . . | 6 . .
-------+-------+-------
 . 3 . | . . . | . 4 .
 . 5 . | 6 1 7 | . 3 .
 . 7 . | . . . | . 1 .
-------+-------+-------
 4 . . | . . . | . . 7
 7 . . | 8 9 3 | . . 1
 9 . . | . . . | . . 8      ER=2.0



Code: Select all

 . . . | . . . | . . .
 . . 1 | 2 3 4 | 5 . .
 . . 5 | . . . | 1 . .
-------+-------+-------
 . 3 . | . . . | . 4 .
 . 6 . | 1 7 8 | . 3 .
 . 8 . | . . . | . 7 .
-------+-------+-------
 4 . . | . . . | . . 8
 8 . . | 5 9 3 | . . 4
 2 . . | . . . | . . 9      ER=7.3



JPF

[Mauricio]

Code: Select all

+-------+-------+-------+
| . . . | . . . | . . . |
| . . 1 | 2 3 4 | 5 . . |
| . . 2 | . . . | 1 . . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| . 3 . | . . . | . 2 . |
| . 6 . | 7 8 1 | . 3 . |
| . 8 . | . . . | . 9 . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| 4 . . | . . . | . . 8 |
| 8 . . | 5 6 9 | . . 4 |
| 9 . . | . . . | . . 7 |
+-------+-------+-------+    ER 4.4


Code: Select all

+-------+-------+-------+
| . . . | . . . | . . . |
| . . 1 | 2 3 4 | 5 . . |
| . . 2 | . . . | 1 . . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| . 3 . | . . . | . 4 . |
| . 6 . | 7 8 1 | . 3 . |
| . 5 . | . . . | . 6 . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| 5 . . | . . . | . . 7 |
| 9 . . | 5 4 6 | . . 2 |
| 8 . . | . . . | . . 6 |
+-------+-------+-------+   ER 4.5


but surprisingly it was hard (for me) to too find an all singles puzzle.

Hmm, I must have mistyped something in my program. I double checked my list and >70% of the puzzles are singles only.