The New Sudoku Players' Forum

[coloin]

your solution grid program is working well i see...and the puzzle identifier is also good !!
I will see if I can get to grips with the it...

however , there are advantages in this scenario of using the maxlexsoutiongrid versions of the puzzle.
All 112 of those initial 11.6/11.7 puzzles come from this expand

Code: Select all

12..5678..5718.6..6.87.2....6.57....5...68..7...2.1..6...82.961.16.....5...61.4..

The puzzles that you found [same solution grid] can be traced to these expands

Code: Select all

12..56.8..5718...26.87.2.1..6.57...85...68...87.2.1......82.....16...8...8.61.4.3 ED=10.5/10.5/2.6

12..5678..57...6.26.87.251..6.57........68..7.7.2.1.....5.2.9.1.1.............47. ED=10.4/10.4/2.6

12..5678..5718.6.26.87.2.1....57........68..7...2.1..6..5.2.9.1.1..........61.4.. ED=10.5/10.5/10.2
12..5678..5718.6.26.87.2.1....57........68..7...2.1..6..5...9.1.1..........61.4.. ED=10.9/10.9/10.3

BTW, with the usual technics, it seems to me difficult to get out of the “tridagon square” of the seed.

Yes its difficult to break out of the 4 boxes with the tridagon ... twin puzzles achieve this ive found though...

[champagne]

however , there are advantages in this scenario of using the maxlexsoutiongrid versions of the puzzle.
All 112 of those initial 11.6/11.7 puzzles come from this expand

Code: Select all

12..5678..5718.6..6.87.2....6.57....5...68..7...2.1..6...82.961.16.....5...61.4..

The puzzles that you found [same solution grid] can be traced to these expands

Code: Select all

12..56.8..5718...26.87.2.1..6.57...85...68...87.2.1......82.....16...8...8.61.4.3 ED=10.5/10.5/2.6
12..5678..57...6.26.87.251..6.57........68..7.7.2.1.....5.2.9.1.1.............47. ED=10.4/10.4/2.6

12..5678..5718.6.26.87.2.1....57........68..7...2.1..6..5.2.9.1.1..........61.4.. ED=10.5/10.5/10.2
12..5678..5718.6.26.87.2.1....57........68..7...2.1..6..5...9.1.1..........61.4.. ED=10.9/10.9/10.3

I did not work on this, but I agree that using maxlexsoutiongrid should make it simpler

If we order the one plus four of your grids in this way

Code: Select all

12..5678..5718.6..6.87.2....6.57....5...68..7...2.1..6...82.961.16.....5...61.4..  36 clues
 
12..5678..5718.6.26.87.2.1....57........68..7...2.1..6..5.2.9.1.1..........61.4..  33 clues
12..5678..5718.6.26.87.2.1....57........68..7...2.1..6..5...9.1.1..........61.4..  32 clues

12..56.8..5718...26.87.2.1..6.57...85...68...87.2.1......82.....16...8...8.61.4.3 36 clues
12..5678..57...6.26.87.251..6.57........68..7.7.2.1.....5.2.9.1.1.............47.   32clues


it seems to me that a vicinity applied here would give your grid starting from the four seeds. But surely several steps needed.
I am surprised to see the second and third seeds differing only by one clue!!

BTW, with the usual technics, it seems to me difficult to get out of the “tridagon square” of the seed.

Yes its difficult to break out of the 4 boxes with the tridagon ... twin puzzles achieve this ive found though...

If an efficient way to use the seeds appears, a good strategy would be to search first new squares, but I am not sure that it is easy to recognize the same square in different solution grids in min lexical morph.
Anyway, seeds with lower ratings must be considered. I'll post ratings 10.5 t 11.x as soon as the test is over.

[champagne]

Hi coloin,

the last discussion on a the solution grid 5472482993 could lead to a significant improvement.

On my side, the bottleneck remains the filter to select the grids of interest in the millions grids in the output of the tridagon finder.
The T&E(1) filter kills more than 99% of the grids, but the rating of the rest is still too long and you have shown that the result is not directly used by you.

I made a test on the "quick solver" that I started when I wanted to have the T&E(1) filter. Expanding a puzzle on rules can be very fast and as you noticed, delivers many duplicates, saving time in the final rating.

I intend to introduce this filter after the T&E(1) filter. It's too late to apply it to the current test, most of the results have already been thrown to the bin, so, I'll redo a test in another tiny area later;

I can push the solving path to different points. From your experience (with no "uniqueness rule"), where is the right cutoff?? For sure what can be coded in a simple and fast way will be considered, but I see as simple in sudoku Explainer rules for example

in block all pointing/claiming eliminations
In block all fishes xwing to turbots and more
in block all unit locked sets (pairs, hidden pairs...)
In block all Ychains (includes XYwing)
....
So far, I have drafted and tested the 2 first rules and I am working on the third one.

I'll do the test in the next days with the rules ready on the 10.5-11.x ratings skfr .

[champagne]

Short summary of the results for al targets in solution grids with a band 1 in the range 320-349 (index)

I got 13907 puzzles with a skfr ER rating in the range 10.5-11.2 (nothing over 11.2)
I did the expand clean using my "quick solver" code and got

3914 different expanded grids
1000 different solution grids.

Knowing that I have seen only one solution grid in mith's file in this tiny area, we can assume 999 new solution grids.

This is still too big for a post, but easy to send by mail to anybody interested in getting the entire file.
I selected as example some results after expansion and re rating.

Code: Select all

5472052039;nnDT3992Kpe5U4;8...5.....4..9...5.5.3........13..57...5.96.3..5.6791.51..73.967..6.5..16..91.57.;110

5472055810;Yhe36A844MTp53;.9..4....3....1.....1.........72..6826.4.81.7.7..1642.....62.74...1.48.6..687.2..;110

5472056429;H3M0eLsO3qeBh2;78...5.1..3.9.8.............5.89..21...4.29.5....5148.2...89.54...1.4..2.4.52.19.;105
5472056429;A9A0iHGPRqe3h0;7...4.2..6....8.4...4.......5..9..211....2...92..5148.....89.54...1.4..2...52.19.;105

5472059357;eBh3cTo5p3ZY13;34.2.8.....6.1..4.9..7.4......48..26..46.17.8.6..7241.4...26.81...8.76.468.14....;105
5472059357;f3hXETm5p5G003;3.5.......7..........7.4......48..262..6.17.8....7241.....26.811..8.76.46..14.2..;106

5472061482;8Y04ani5UPDUj6;.....8.4...7........9.4....3..48..565..3.28.48.4.5632...5.64.8....8.54.2..823.56.;109

5472061896;rmPR0G19AhgcU1;.6.......9....7...2....8..13..87..56..61.53.7.5..6318.....86.73...3.16.563.75..1.;108
5472061896;rmPR1C39AhgcU1;1.....7..9...17...2....8..13..87..56..61.53.7.5..6318.5...86.73...3.16.563.75..1.;105

5472063425;o6h3hTOck1Em90;3...19...7...56...8.....5....816..252.69.58.1....8269..2..98.5668.5.1......62.18.;111

5472066663;gG4G0m8bPpRpe0;.2....6.4.5....9.........3.87.36..49......8.334..9876...6.43..8...8.9..6...67....;107
5472066663;gG4G0o8bPpRpe0;.2....6.4.5....9.........3.87.36..49......8.334..9876...6.43..8...8.9..6...67..9.;107
5472066663;gG4G0o8rPpRpe0;.2....6.4.5....9.........3.87.36..49......8.334..9876..96.43..8...8.9..6...67..9.;105
5472066663;AK0H0o85PpRpe0;.2.9....4.5.......6......3.87.36..49......8.334..9876.....43..8...8.9..6...67..9.;111
5472066663;AK0H0o8bPpRpg0;.2.9....4.5.......6......3.87.36..49.6....8.334..9876...6.43..8...8.9..6...67..9.;110
here all results for this solution grid

5472067317;8A9GO6UfLbS3s1;.8......46....4..1.......3.9..51..42.2.4.93.5....3219.....95.13..52.34..3..14.52.;111

5472074297;p2he3CImIoTpi3;...7....1.3..1.....91.6.2...1.57..68..51.87.287..2651.....81.26...2.71.512.65.8..;109
5472074297;p2heZ4IGIm5pi3;..87......3..1.....9..6.2.....57..68..51.87.2....2651.....81.26...2.71.512.65.8..;109

5472074446;2960QfLsO56Sc5;....7..2..89.....4.....1...5..73..42.4.1.25.7....4513...4.27......5.42.3..531.47.;111

5472077643;g3hW6GqK6QMTn5;...4.......5.6.14..3....86..4.27..16.1.6.47.87...8142.....26.81.2.8.76.4...14.2..;111

5472095763;1IhfZCGGWs5pe3;..41....8....7.....3.....1..6572..81...8.56.2....1675..5..81.266..2.71.51.....8..;111

5472242347;i82TfmIY0jUMU0;.97.42....5.6....4....5.......82..56.6.4.53.2.25.6348.5...86.23.....4..8....3.64.;112

5472682358;GC2WQq5peJsH50;.5....9...8.4.......7.....2...71..94..12.47.3....9312.3...41..9.4.3.72.1...92....;110
5472682358;GC2WQs5peJsH50;.5....9...8.4.......7.....2...71..94.912.47.3....9312.3...41..9.4.3.72.1...92....;112



[coloin]

I can push the solving path to different points. From your experience (with no "uniqueness rule"), where is the right cutoff?? .

The cut off I used was SE 11.0 …. Although realistically for most puzzles it was 11.5
Most BxB 6 and above puzzles are SE 11.5 and above .
This was my “ tridagon” finder … as there is a hump in the incidence after 11.2

I expanded the puzzles maximally to maintain the SE and BxB … rarely there was a disagreement .
Expanding reduces the total number to rate. It also increases the chance that a twin puzzle is found - and these were used as new seeds … ( this tended to change the 4 boxes concerned in the tridagon .

These puzzles were in T&E 2 mostly …. The T&E 3 were likely to be less than SE 11 - but now we understand that the uniqueness glitch did that.

[champagne]

I expanded the puzzles maximally to maintain the SE and BxB … rarely there was a disagreement .

I'll keep this as guideline for the future.
I am busy for the next weeks, but anyway, I had finished what I can do on this topic.
Her are the results of my last test.

====================================
I run the test on the first solution grids of the band1 index 60 in the catalog
and found 26000 targets in the first 55625 solution grid

Then running 6 cores in parallel to find <= 26 clues
I got 81 606 139 pure tridagon grids in 39123 seconds

Around 35 seconds per target but 3.9 seconds per solution grids. (in the proof that no 16 clues exists, Gary Mc Guire team has a similar run time per grid)

_________________________

The T&E(1) filter cleared in 114 seconds 98.24% of the grids, leaving 1 437 088 grids
Then a “solver” step expanded these grids in about 480 seconds including the sort clean of redundant
__________________________
And the final set of grids to rate has been 239 097,
0.00293% of the finder output.
Doing so, the rating runtime was similar to the finder’s runtime.
And 598 grids were rated 10.5-11.2 hitting 212 solution grids .

here are the highest ratings

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5.6..4..97......4...1.........54..92...7.95.39.5.2347..23.97.54.5.3.29.....45....;11.1/10.4/3.4
...9....2189.2..7........9....23..69...4.63.736..9724..7..69..4...3.27.66..74.92.;11.1/10.5/10.3
.....3...7..4...5.8......1....13..25..19.23.4....4519.....91.32.2.5.49....932.54.;11.1/11.1/10.3
.....3...7..4...5.8......1....13..25..19.23.4....4519.4...91.32.2.5.49....932.54.;11.1/11.1/10.3
...9....2189.2..7........9....23..69...4.63.7.6..9724.27..69..4...3.27.66..74.92.;11.1/11.1/10.4
...9....2189.2..7........9...723..69...4.63.7.6..9724.27..69..4...3.27.66..74.92.;11.1/11.1/10.4
...9....2189.2...........9...723..69...4.67.3.6..9724.2...69..4...7.23.66..34.92.;11.1/11.1/2.6
..6...1...8....4..73.415......79..419..5.17.3....3495.....53.19...9.75.4.9.14.3..;11.1/11.1/2.6
.6..3....9........5....8....2.38..47...7.62.88...2436.....47.8....2.34.6.4.86.73.;11.1/11.1/2.6
5.6..4..97......4...1......3..54..92...7.95.39.5.2347..23.97.54.5.3.29.....45....;11.1/11.1/3.4
4.6.3...........3.7...9....2.198..63...1.28.9....6312.....29..8...3.82.6.2.61.39.;11.1/4.5/2.6
...4..9...57.8..............1.36..98.3.8.14.6..6.9431...1.48..9.9.6.31.4...91.86.;11.2/11.2/7.6


This is likely too long for a full scan, but open the door for the search of new seeds.