The hardest sudokus (new thread)

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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Sat Aug 29, 2015 5:40 am

Obi-Wahn wrote:I finally found my own Sudoku that can keep up with the hardest ones. SE121 rates it as 11.8 and it also reaches the highest category "star" of my own solver.


Champagne, I hope you still read this thread.


Hi Obi_Wahn,

Congratulations, it is a new one (for me) in an area already deeply searched (22 clues).
I have may pending updates to include in the data base, so I'll finish the task and upload an update to-day or to_morrow.

That one should be the highest rating of the updates
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Sat Aug 29, 2015 5:57 am

coloin wrote:Thanks for reminding me that I had some more too. I believe these are not in champagne's list

Hi coloin,
I did not see your post before I answered to Obi-Whan

As the priority remains to the first public post, I stop the update I just started to include the new in your list.

For the highest rating (say over 11) I try to stay to the serate rating to have an homogeneous set of ratings in that area.

Could you, to save time on my side me re post your list in the following format

puzzles ;er;ep;ed

98.7.....7.....9....2.95...47........3.4..7....6....1....84.3.......6..2.....2..1;11.8;11.8;2.6

or at the minimum without the 2 first ratings

EDIT I did it using my data base tool, it's ok
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Sat Aug 29, 2015 6:45 am

coloin wrote:Thanks for reminding me that I had some more too. I believe these are not in champagne's list

Hi again coloin,

Update done, all appeared new
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby dobrichev » Sat Aug 29, 2015 9:52 am

Bravo to Obi_Wahn and Coloin for the new findings!
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby Obi-Wahn » Sat Aug 29, 2015 1:57 pm

And another one that SE121 even rates 11.9

Code: Select all
5.6...7...1.3.....8...5.9.....1...2.....8.6.7.....2.4.7...9...6.3...42....5...... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2;OW-MF20-01754-J8
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby eleven » Sat Aug 29, 2015 2:11 pm

Wow, congrats to Obi_Wahn and Coloin ! I really thought, that we already had all puzzles with ER above 11.6. Now there are four [Edit: five !] more, and all have 22 clues. The sudoku space is wide.

I had a closer look at Lightsaber. And yes, it's not easy, i needed one and a half hours to solve it :) (with a little help of a simple solver)
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby m_b_metcalf » Sat Aug 29, 2015 2:43 pm

Obi-Wahn wrote:I finally found my own Sudoku that can keep up with the hardest ones. SE121 rates it as 11.8 and it also reaches the highest category "star" of my own solver.
Code: Select all
Lightsaber
5 . 6|. . .|7 . .
. 1 .|3 . .|. . .
7 . .|. 5 .|8 . .
-----+-----+-----
. . .|1 . .|. 2 .
. . .|. 7 .|6 . 8
. . .|. . 2|1 4 .
-----+-----+-----
8 . .|. 9 .|. . 6
. 3 .|. . 4|. . .
. . 5|. . .|. . .    ED=11.7/1.2/1.2 (skfr)



Dear Obi-Wahn,
I took the liberty of looking for some siblings to keep your puzzle company, and found these:

Code: Select all
 1 . 2 . . . 3 . .
 . 4 . 5 . . . . .
 6 . . . 1 . 2 . .
 . . . 7 . . . 4 .
 . . . . 3 . 6 . 2
 . . . . . 4 7 8 .
 2 . . . 9 . . . 6
 . 5 . . . 8 . . .
 . . 1 . . . . . .   ED=10.5/1.2/1.2

 1 . 2 . . . 3 . .
 . 4 . 5 . . . . .
 3 . . . 1 . 6 . .
 . . . 4 . . . 7 .
 . . . . 3 . 2 . 6
 . . . . . 7 8 9 .
 6 . . . 8 . . . 2
 . 5 . . . 4 . . .
 . . 1 . . . . . .   ED=10.7/1.2/1.2


Regards,

Mike Metcalf
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Sat Aug 29, 2015 2:46 pm

Obi-Wahn wrote:And another one that SE121 even rates 11.9


I finished the update of the data base and I am preparing usual comment before loading the update.

I can add more puzzles till late to-day and then I'll stop for that update.

The comment will not account these late additions, but it's not a key point

EDIT the referee version for the data base rates it 11.9, the puzzles is added with that rating
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby Obi-Wahn » Sat Aug 29, 2015 6:04 pm

Thanks, champagne,
here's the rest of my findings that I haven't posted so far.

Code: Select all
5.6.7.....1...3...7.....8.6...1...4...5.9.6...3...2...9...8.5.....4...2...7....6. ED=10.9/1.2/1.2;OW-MF20-00436-J1
5.6.7.....1.3.....7.....6.....1...3...5.8.9...4...2..79.......6.....4.2...8.5.7.. ED=11.3/1.2/1.2;OW-MF20-00763-J1
5.6.7.....1.2.....8.....6...3.1.......5.8.7.......2.4.9.......6...4...39..8.9.5.. ED=11.1/1.2/1.2;OW-MF20-00763-J2
5.6.7.....1...3...8.....6...4.1.......8.9.7..9....2.3.6.......5...4...2...9.5.8.. ED=11.2/11.2/9.7;OW-MF20-00763-J3
5.6.7.....1...3...8.....6...4.1.......8.9.7.......2.3.6....9..5...4...2...9.5.8.. ED=10.7/10.7/9.7;OW-MF20-00763-J4
5.6.7.....1.3.....8.....6...3.1.......8.5...7.....2.4.9.......8.....492...5.9...6 ED=10.6/1.2/1.2;OW-MF20-00795-J1
5.6.7.....1...3.5.......8.....1...3.6...5.9...4...2...9.....6.8...4...2...7.8...5 ED=10.9/10.7/9.0;OW-MF20-01458-J1
5.6.7.....1...3.........8....91...3.6...9.7...4...2...9.....5.8...4...2...8.5...6 ED=11.2/11.2/9.7;OW-MF20-01458-J2
5.6...7...1.3.....8...5.6.....1...4.....8.9.7.....2...6...9...8.3...4.2...5...... ED=11.1/1.2/1.2;OW-MF20-01754-J3
5.6...7...1.3.....8...5.6.....1.........9.8.6.....2.4.9...7...8.3...4.2...5....6. ED=11.0/1.2/1.2;OW-MF20-01754-J4
5.6...7...1.3.....8...5.9.....1.........7.8.6.....2.4.9...6...7.4...3.2...5...... ED=10.7/1.2/1.2;OW-MF20-01754-J7

For the rating I used skfr. If I should use serate, is there a link to an up-to-date version?
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Sat Aug 29, 2015 6:48 pm

Obi-Wahn wrote:Thanks, champagne,
here's the rest of my findings that I haven't posted so far.

For the rating I used skfr. If I should use serate, is there a link to an up-to-date version?


I'll check and add these to-morrow morning.

You have no up-to-date version of serate. Nicolas Juillerat stopped updating years ago.

I use as referee the version of the pattern game. The same as you I guess.

Normally, I re rate puzzles passing 11.1 with skfr to be sure to have an homogeneous set of puzzles in the high ratings
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Sun Aug 30, 2015 9:30 am

I just made an update of the data base of potential hardest

as for all new files , that update is in my "google drive space" with the name ph_1508.zip

the link to that storage place is here



The file contains now 1 583 105 puzzles including the last posted

the count per clue in the data base is the following
20 77
21 10794
22 87082
23 341310
24 541278
25 376668
26 225713

The count per er is the following

er CompteDeer
11.9 9 +1 (obi_whan)
11.8 53 +3 (obi-whan and coloin additions)
11.7 113 +1
11.6 186 +2
11.5 545 +16
11.4 1353 +29

Congratulations agains to coloin and Obi-Whan for the new very high ratings
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby ronk » Sun Nov 29, 2015 10:53 pm

champagne wrote:I just made an update of the data base of potential hardest

as for all new files , that update is in my "google drive space" with the name ph_1508.zip

the link to that storage place is here

Do you still support a "multi_fish rank 0.txt" file that gave the type(s) of 0-rank patterns found? For example, from an older release ...

........9.....1.35..3.9..6...5.3...6.7...2...1..4.......9.8..5..2.7.....4.....8..;321;col;H12;1;1247; ; ;X; ;;

... indicates Row and Column rank-0 patterns do not exist, but that is incorrect.
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Mon Nov 30, 2015 7:53 am

ronk wrote:Do you still support a "multi_fish rank 0.txt" file that gave the type(s) of 0-rank patterns found? For example, from an older release ...

........9.....1.35..3.9..6...5.3...6.7...2...1..4.......9.8..5..2.7.....4.....8..;321;col;H12;1;1247; ; ;X; ;;

... indicates Row and Column rank-0 patterns do not exist, but that is incorrect.


Last updates have only the new puzzles and this should also be the case for the next one including recent findings from the pattern games and new puzzles I found in the 23_25 clues area (mainly 24_25)

I did not run the search for exotic patterns for a while, and I don't intend to restart it before all my code is collected in my new 64 bits infrastructure.

regarding all "exotic files" they are produced to help players looking for specific properties. They are representing what my code can identify.

More specifically for the rank_0 logic, my code is limited, and does not use for example boxes sets in general.

A wrong positive would be a bug, a missing Rank-0 will generally be a weakness of my code, but can also be a bug.

next year, if all is going well, I should explore seriously the 26 clues area. I'll start the task when the seeds base for 25 clues will be big enough
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby ronk » Tue Dec 01, 2015 5:42 pm

champagne wrote:regarding all "exotic files" they are produced to help players looking for specific properties. They are representing what my code can identify.

More specifically for the rank_0 logic, my code is limited, and does not use for example boxes sets in general.

A wrong positive would be a bug, a missing Rank-0 will generally be a weakness of my code, but can also be a bug.

That's good to know. I assume that a puzzle makes it onto the 0-rank list because your code identifies at least one 0-rank "pattern" in the puzzle, correct?
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Wed Dec 02, 2015 11:01 am

ronk wrote:That's good to know. I assume that a puzzle makes it onto the 0-rank list because your code identifies at least one 0-rank "pattern" in the puzzle, correct?


right int your example, the solver says
Code: Select all
........9.....1.35..3.9..6...5.3...6.7...2...1..4.......9.8..5..2.7.....4.....8..

floors 1247 added sets
SLG rank 0
19 Truths = {1R47 1C35 2R47 2C35 4R47 4C35 7R47 7C35 1N7 2N7 3N7 }
19 Links = {1c7 1b578 2c7 2b48 4c7 4b48 7c7 7b57 1n35 2n35 4n8 7n9 }
22 elims 6r1c3 8r1c3 5r1c5 6r1c5 6r2c3 8r2c3 6r2c5 8r4c8 9r4c8 3r7c9 1r5c4 7r6c6 1r9c2 1r9c4 2r9c4 4r8c6 1r5c7 1r8c7 2r6c7 4r5c7 4r8c7 7r6c7
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