Patterns Game 1.0

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Postby ab » Wed Jul 25, 2007 10:02 pm

bit of a jump, a 6.6
Code: Select all
 . . . | . . . | . . 7
 . 6 4 | . . . | . 5 .
 2 . . | 3 . . | 1 . .
 ------+-------+------
 . 7 1 | . . 4 | . . .
 . . . | . . . | . . .
 . . . | 8 . . | 3 9 .
 ------+-------+------
 . . 6 | . . 1 | . . 4
 . 5 . | . . . | 8 6 .
 9 . . | . . . | . . .
ab
 
Posts: 451
Joined: 06 September 2005

Postby JPF » Wed Jul 25, 2007 10:37 pm

I got these ones :

Code: Select all
 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|1..|6..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.37|..4|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|8..|92.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..4|..7|..3|
 |.6.|...|59.|
 |8..|...|...|
 *-----------*    ER=5.8

 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|6..|7..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.17|..3|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|5..|68.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..2|..7|..3|
 |.4.|...|56.|
 |8..|...|...|
 *-----------*    ER=6.5


JPF
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Postby TTHsieh » Thu Jul 26, 2007 3:04 am

It's hard to get 5.8 (JPF) and 6.2
Code: Select all
. . . | . . . | . . 9
. 5 8 | . . . | . 4 .
7 . . | 1 . . | 3 . .
- - - + - - - + - - -
. 1 4 | . . 5 | . . .
. . . | . . . | . . .
. . . | 3 . . | 2 9 .
- - - + - - - + - - -
. . 9 | . . 4 | . . 7
. 3 . | . . . | 8 1 .
2 . . | . . . | . . .  ER = 6.2


TTHsieh
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Posts: 1390
Joined: 13 July 2007

Postby ravel » Thu Jul 26, 2007 7:59 am

Thanks for leaving me this one:) Maybe a point system would be fairer - e.g. a point for each new rating.
Code: Select all
 +-------------------+
 | . . . . . . . . 5 |
 | . 3 8 . . . . 4 . |
 | 1 . . 2 . . 3 . . |
 | . 5 4 . . 7 . . . |
 | . . . . . . . . . |
 | . . . 9 . . 1 8 . |
 | . . 7 . . 5 . . 4 |
 | . 2 . . . . 9 6 . |
 | 9 . . . . . . . . |
 +-------------------+ ER 6.7
ravel
 
Posts: 998
Joined: 21 February 2006

Postby TTHsieh » Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:08 am

Code: Select all
. . . | . . . | . . 9
. 4 5 | . . . | . 1 .
8 . . | 2 . . | 3 . .
- - - + - - - + - - -
. 9 7 | . . 4 | . . .
. . . | . . . | . . .
. . . | 3 . . | 8 6 .
- - - + - - - + - - -
. . 9 | . . 1 | . . 7
. 5 . | . . . | 2 3 .
6 . . | . . . | . . .  ER = 7.5


TTHsieh
TTHsieh
 
Posts: 1390
Joined: 13 July 2007

Postby JPF » Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:57 am

ravel wrote:Maybe a point system would be fairer - e.g. a point for each new rating.
Right!
After this pattern, new rules (points, timing, etc...) will be set up.

There are lots of ratings between 6.7 and 7.5...

My new proposal, first :
Code: Select all
 . . . | . . . | . . 1
 . 2 3 | . . . | . 4 .
 5 . . | 6 . . | 7 . .
-------+-------+-------
 . 8 1 | . . 9 | . . .
 . . . | . . . | . . .
 . . . | 7 . . | 6 8 .
-------+-------+-------
 . . 9 | . . 3 | . . 4
 . 5 . | . . . | 8 2 .
 7 . . | . . . | . . .     ER=7.6


Note that Explainer uses 51 forcing chains (including 4 Turbo fish) for this one.
Not equivalent to :
Code: Select all
 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.21|...|.3.|
 |4..|5..|6..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.78|..2|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|9..|54.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..6|..9|..7|
 |.1.|...|42.|
 |3..|...|...|
 *-----------*     ER=7.6


with a low number of chains

JPF
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Postby ravel » Thu Jul 26, 2007 9:10 am

JPF wrote:There are lots of ratings between 6.7 and 7.5...
The easy ones:
Code: Select all
 +-------------------+
 | . . . . . . . . 5 |
 | . 5 9 . . . . 4 . |
 | 1 . . 2 . . 3 . . |
 | . 9 6 . . 8 . . . |
 | . . . . . . . . . |
 | . . . 7 . . 8 1 . |
 | . . 7 . . 6 . . 9 |
 | . 8 . . . . 2 7 . |
 | 5 . . . . . . . . |
 +-------------------+ ER 7.1
 +-------------------+
 | . . . . . . . . 5 |
 | . 2 5 . . . . 4 . |
 | 1 . . 2 . . 3 . . |
 | . 5 8 . . 9 . . . |
 | . . . . . . . . . |
 | . . . 7 . . 2 3 . |
 | . . 9 . . 6 . . 1 |
 | . 4 . . . . 7 8 . |
 | 7 . . . . . . . . |
 +-------------------+ ER 7.2
 +-------------------+
 | . . . . . . . . 5 |
 | . 6 7 . . . . 4 . |
 | 1 . . 2 . . 3 . . |
 | . 3 8 . . 7 . . . |
 | . . . . . . . . . |
 | . . . 1 . . 2 8 . |
 | . . 5 . . 4 . . 7 |
 | . 2 . . . . 9 6 . |
 | 3 . . . . . . . . |
 +-------------------+ ER 7.3
Next ones:
Code: Select all
 +-------------------+
 | . . . . . . . . 5 |
 | . 6 7 . . . . 4 . |
 | 1 . . 2 . . 3 . . |
 | . 3 1 . . 4 . . . |
 | . . . . . . . . . |
 | . . . 6 . . 2 8 . |
 | . . 4 . . 5 . . 1 |
 | . 2 . . . . 6 9 . |
 | 3 . . . . . . . . |
 +-------------------+ ER 7.7
 +-------------------+
 | . . . . . . . . 5 |
 | . 6 7 . . . . 4 . |
 | 1 . . 2 . . 3 . . |
 | . 5 1 . . 3 . . . |
 | . . . . . . . . . |
 | . . . 6 . . 2 8 . |
 | . . 9 . . 5 . . 7 |
 | . 4 . . . . 9 6 . |
 | 8 . . . . . . . . |
 +-------------------+ ER 7.8
ravel
 
Posts: 998
Joined: 21 February 2006

Postby JPF » Thu Jul 26, 2007 9:59 am

ravel wrote:
JPF wrote:There are lots of ratings between 6.7 and 7.5...
The easy ones...


less easy:

Code: Select all
 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|6..|7..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.17|..3|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|8..|65.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..1|..7|..3|
 |.9.|...|86.|
 |8..|...|...|
 *-----------*    ER=6.8

 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|6..|7..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.41|..8|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|7..|56.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..9|..3|..4|
 |.7.|...|29.|
 |6..|...|...|
 *-----------*   ER=6.9

 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|6..|7..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.18|..2|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|9..|65.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..7|..3|..8|
 |.4.|...|57.|
 |1..|...|...|
 *-----------*   ER=7.0
 

JPF
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Postby JPF » Thu Jul 26, 2007 10:38 am

My proposal :

Code: Select all
 . . . | . . . | . . 1
 . 1 2 | . . . | . 3 .
 4 . . | 5 . . | 6 . .
-------+-------+-------
 . 2 7 | . . 3 | . . .
 . . . | . . . | . . .
 . . . | 4 . . | 5 6 .
-------+-------+-------
 . . 3 | . . 2 | . . 7
 . 8 . | . . . | 4 5 .
 6 . . | . . . | . . .    ER=7.9


Explainer uses 11 forcing chains, 9 of them are Nishio forcing chains

JPF
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Postby TTHsieh » Thu Jul 26, 2007 12:41 pm

My new post.
Code: Select all
. . . | . . . | . . 9
. 4 6 | . . . | . 1 .
8 . . | 3 . . | 6 . .
- - - + - - - + - - -
. 1 9 | . . 4 | . . .
. . . | . . . | . . .
. . . | 8 . . | 5 7 .
- - - + - - - + - - -
. . 4 | . . 1 | . . 6
. 3 . | . . . | 8 2 .
5 . . | . . . | . . .  ER = 9.1


and fill in the gap.
Code: Select all
. . . | . . . | . . 9
. 4 7 | . . . | . 2 .
5 . . | 8 . . | 3 . .
- - - + - - - + - - -
. 1 9 | . . 5 | . . .
. . . | . . . | . . .
. . . | 3 . . | 8 6 .
- - - + - - - + - - -
. . 2 | . . 7 | . . 1
. 3 . | . . . | 6 4 .
6 . . | . . . | . . .  ER = 7.4


TTHsieh
TTHsieh
 
Posts: 1390
Joined: 13 July 2007

Postby JPF » Thu Jul 26, 2007 7:06 pm

TTHsieh wrote:My new post.
Code: Select all
ER = 9.1


a big jump and a big gap:)

Here are the missing values except 8.0 and 8.1 :
Code: Select all
 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.12|...|.3.|
 |4..|5..|6..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.27|..3|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|4..|56.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..3|..2|..7|
 |.8.|...|45.|
 |6..|...|...|
 *-----------*     ER=7.9

 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|6..|7..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.18|..4|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|2..|67.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..1|..8|..4|
 |.6.|...|92.|
 |7..|...|...|
 *-----------*     ER=8.2

 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|6..|7..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.81|..9|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|7..|68.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..4|..3|..9|
 |.5.|...|82.|
 |7..|...|...|
 *-----------*     ER=8.3

 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|6..|7..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.81|..9|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|2..|65.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..9|..4|..8|
 |.7.|...|23.|
 |3..|...|...|
 *-----------*     ER=8.4

 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|6..|7..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.78|..1|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|7..|93.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..1|..3|..4|
 |.6.|...|52.|
 |9..|...|...|
 *-----------*     ER=8.5

 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|6..|7..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.78|..1|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|4..|69.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..1|..8|..4|
 |.5.|...|92.|
 |7..|...|...|
 *-----------*     ER=8.6

 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|6..|7..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.18|..2|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|7..|69.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..5|..3|..2|
 |.9.|...|51.|
 |7..|...|...|
 *-----------*     ER=8.7

 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.12|...|.3.|
 |3..|4..|5..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.61|..3|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|5..|74.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..6|..2|..3|
 |.5.|...|48.|
 |7..|...|...|
 *-----------*     ER=8.8

 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|6..|7..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.89|..3|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|2..|65.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..1|..9|..8|
 |.7.|...|42.|
 |4..|...|...|
 *-----------*     ER=8.9

 *-----------*
 |...|...|..1|
 |.23|...|.4.|
 |5..|6..|7..|
 |---+---+---|
 |.45|..3|...|
 |...|...|...|
 |...|7..|68.|
 |---+---+---|
 |..1|..5|..4|
 |.3.|...|82.|
 |7..|...|...|
 *-----------*     ER=9.0


JPF
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Posts: 3754
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Location: Paris, France

Postby TTHsieh » Thu Jul 26, 2007 11:07 pm

to fill in the gap.
Code: Select all
. . . | . . . | . . 9
. 4 7 | . . . | . 5 .
6 . . | 2 . . | 3 . .
- - - + - - - + - - -
. 9 4 | . . 7 | . . .
. . . | . . . | . . .
. . . | 3 . . | 8 2 .
- - - + - - - + - - -
. . 9 | . . 5 | . . 4
. 3 . | . . . | 2 7 .
8 . . | . . . | . . .  ER = 8.0


TTHsieh
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Posts: 1390
Joined: 13 July 2007

Postby TTHsieh » Thu Aug 02, 2007 8:06 am

in my experience, ERs of the previous pattern: 3.8, 5.8, 6.2, 8.0, 8.7, 9.1 are very hard to get.
pattern with big diamond wrote:Image


my proposal for next challenge.
Code: Select all
1 . . | . 2 . | . . 4
. . . | 6 . 1 | . . .
. . 4 | . . . | 5 . .
- - - + - - - + - - -
. 3 . | . . . | . 6 .
6 . . | . . . | . . 8
. 2 . | . . . | . 9 .
- - - + - - - + - - -
. . 9 | . . . | 4 . .
. . . | 2 . 3 | . . .
7 . . | . 8 . | . . 2  ER = 1.2


TTHsieh
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Posts: 1390
Joined: 13 July 2007

Postby ravel » Thu Aug 02, 2007 11:01 am

Congratulations TTHsieh,

you have found much more than me. I am off (my computer) for some time, so i cannot join in now. Also i am awaiting JPF's new rules.
ravel
 
Posts: 998
Joined: 21 February 2006

Postby JPF » Thu Aug 02, 2007 10:08 pm

Yes, congratualtions TTHsieh for your puzzles.

I think the rules should be changed a bit in order to :
  • enable more players to participate.
  • explore all the different SE ratings of a pattern
As far as the tempo is concerned, we need to keep in mind that when some people work, others sleep.

Proposal :
Each posted puzzle must have a new ER and has to be minimal.
First post (dealer) = singles
other post = 2 puzzles max, say for 2 days, except if an other player posts a puzzle.

The game ends if no puzzle has been posted for 1 week.

Points : when a puzzle is posted the player gets points = # posted puzzle.
i.e : the dealer gets 1 pt, next puzzle 2 pt, etc...
At the end of the game a 10 pts bonus is given to the higher SE rating.

Any comments are welcome.

The new rules will only be used after the actual TTHsieh proposed pattern.

JPF
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Posts: 3754
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