inferior puzzles thread

Everything about Sudoku that doesn't fit in one of the other sections

Postby Ocean » Sat May 27, 2006 6:42 pm

gsf wrote:-o output-file added and posted

Thanks. That was fast response!
Now I can test the input and actually 'see' what happens.
gsf wrote:here are the low steppers from a background process that's scanned ~250M random symmetric puzzles so far
I don't think these have made it into the table yet
...
I,8,28,SM,000010000002769800080050040070000090319000582050000030090040070005687400000030000,gsf,NEW
Fine! You are immediately challenged with this one (from oceanM20.txt):
Code: Select all
#Ocean [M20/F20][S8]
...|...|...
..1|.2.|3..
.4.|1.5|.6.
---+---+---
..3|...|7..
.8.|...|.4.
..9|...|2..
---+---+---
.5.|4.7|.8.
..2|.1.|9..
...|...|...

Reformatted by your program 'sudoku.exe':
'I,8,20,M,000000000001020300040105060003000700080000040009000200050407080002010900000000000,Ocean,new'

I have now treated all submitted lowsteppers in such a way that the reformatting program eats them as input.

A few comments to the program:
1. Is it possible to carry the 'puzzle creator's name' through the reformatting process?
2. The chosen output format does not fit as input to the program. Which means that submissions in this format need some kind of preprocessing (lots of mouse clicks, or a preprocessor program for long files).
3. Not sure how to sort the reformatted puzzles approprietly (except by carrying them over to unix and use some tricks there).

Anyway, the lowstepper-thread is updated with all puzzles reformatted, but unsorted and 'lost creator'. Will be happy for any suggestions. Else it might take a few days before I have a streamlined process.
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Postby gsf » Sun May 28, 2006 9:11 am

Ocean wrote:A few comments to the program:
1. Is it possible to carry the 'puzzle creator's name' through the reformatting process?
2. The chosen output format does not fit as input to the program. Which means that submissions in this format need some kind of preprocessing (lots of mouse clicks, or a preprocessor program for long files).
3. Not sure how to sort the reformatted puzzles approprietly (except by carrying them over to unix and use some tricks there).

0. download again
1. yes, via -f, either by field position %($7)f, or by names of your choice assigned by -c
Code: Select all
-c5,sym,num,clues,min,puz,author,seq

and then referencing by %($author)s
you can put
Code: Select all
#!sudoku -c5,sym,num,clues,min,puz,author,seq -B2

as the first line in the puzzle data file and the options required to parse and
process will travel with the data
2. use -c to identify the puzzle field, and modify -f to carry through the non-compted fields
3. I had to use sort and a ksh script -- you can download uwin for all the section (1) commands
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29 clues, no symmetry

Postby Pat » Sun Jun 04, 2006 8:38 am

this puzzle is taken from a recent newspaper,
i wonder how it would rate —
  • how many steps?
  • how many tight steps (single-cell)?
[ no symmetry ]
Code: Select all
 . 8 6 | . . . | 7 3 .
 . . . | . . . | . . .
 2 . . | 7 . 8 | . . 6
-------+-------+------
 . 2 5 | 9 . 4 | 1 . 3
 . 3 . | . . . | . 2 .
 . . 7 | 3 2 5 | 8 . .
-------+-------+------
 9 . . | 8 . 6 | . . 4
 . . . | . . . | . . .
 . 6 4 | . . . | 9 1 .


thanks!

~ Pat
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Re: 29 clues, no symmetry

Postby tarek » Sun Jun 04, 2006 9:30 am

Pat wrote:
  • how many steps?
  • how many tight steps (single-cell)?
[ no symmetry ]
Code: Select all
 . 8 6 | . . . | 7 3 .
 . . . | . . . | . . .
 2 . . | 7 . 8 | . . 6
-------+-------+------
 . 2 5 | 9 . 4 | 1 . 3
 . 3 . | . . . | . 2 .
 . . 7 | 3 2 5 | 8 . .
-------+-------+------
 9 . . | 8 . 6 | . . 4
 . . . | . . . | . . .
 . 6 4 | . . . | 9 1 .


Hi Pat,

29 cells, Not symmetrical Not Minimal

12 Steps, Step Count 01 01 01 03 01 02 05 07 07 09 08 07

It has a hard start, then it opens up

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re: 29 clues, no symmetry

Postby Pat » Sun Jun 04, 2006 11:23 am

tarek wrote:29 cells, Not symmetrical Not Minimal

12 steps, 1 1 1 3 1 2 5 7 7 9 8 7

It has a hard start, then it opens up

thanks, tarek!

    i did cheat — the original puzzle was a 26-clue Pappocom puzzle from HaAretz (2006.Jun.1) [ thanks to my SuDoku correspondent in Israel ] — i added 3 clues [ r4c29, r6c5 ] to improve the inferior rating.
the Pappocom rating of this puzzle is Hard; in the inferior rating, it compares quite well with the famous Very Hard puzzle — The Sunday Times #31:
Ruud (2006.Apr.23) wrote:There are 13 steps.

No tight steps, the pattern is 6 3 3 3 3 3 4 3 4 7 8 8 1
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39 steps

Postby Pat » Thu May 15, 2008 2:23 pm


        the highest number of steps was apparently 30 ?

      now in another Topic, tarek (2008.May.13) has posted one needing 39 steps !

      [ 23 clues ]

      [ the Pappocom rating of this puzzle is Hard ]
Code: Select all
 . . 5 | 7 . . | . . .
 . 1 . | 9 3 . | 7 . .
 . . 6 | . . . | . . 4
-------+-------+------
 . . 8 | . . . | . 5 .
 . . . | . 9 . | . . .
 . 5 . | . 7 . | . . 2
-------+-------+------
 . 3 . | . . . | . 4 .
 . 8 7 | . . . | . . .
 . 4 . | . 6 8 | 3 1 .

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Postby tarek » Sat May 17, 2008 12:10 pm

I was hoping for a 40 stepper.... my computer is not powerful enough to cope ....

I will check for symmetrical puzzel in 800k collection of 31+ steppers, will report in a few weeks.

tarek
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Postby olimpia » Sat Nov 15, 2008 5:34 pm

gsf wrote:all 22M 18's were checked for symmetry as is
the 18's as is only show antidiagonal symmetry

I know this discussion was more than 2 years ago but if anyone is still interested there does appear to be some 18 clue puzzles with horizontal symmetry. One example is:
"Electra" (by Vic Reinhart)
Code: Select all
....1....
.5.....7.
..72.36..
.........
81.....95
...4.2...
..3...2..
.9..5..1.
.........
(I'm not sure if this has an isomorph in the original 22M list)
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Postby Pat » Sun Nov 16, 2008 6:03 am

olimpia wrote:
gsf wrote:all 22M 18's were checked for symmetry as is
the 18's as is only show antidiagonal symmetry



if anyone is still interested there does appear to be some 18 clue puzzles with horizontal symmetry.

One example is: "Electra" (by Vic Reinhart)

Code: Select all
 . . . . 1 . . . .
 . 5 . . . . . 7 .
 . . 7 2 . 3 6 . .
 . . . . . . . . .
 8 1 . . . . . 9 5
 . . . 4 . 2 . . .
 . . 3 . . . 2 . .
 . 9 . . 5 . . 1 .
 . . . . . . . . .




just note that this part of the discussion was off-topic
and your puzzle too cannot be solved by "singles"
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Postby olimpia » Sun Nov 16, 2008 8:15 am

my apologies.:(
I was intrigued by 18 clue puzzles but failed to notice its not related to the topic.
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