The New Sudoku Players' Forum

[denis_berthier]

.
Again: stick to facts.

[ghfick]

I have no interest in following your directions. You are 'Not the Boss of me'.
I will stick to the points that I think are important.
It is unclear if the Mac world will survive. One fact is the Mac market share. Not promising.
My old Mac laptop may be nearing the end of its life. I suspect I will replace it with laptop that will accept a Linux OS. Linux has a quite stable usage and for good reason.
Recent Apple actions are not encouraging.

[denis_berthier]

.
Interesting twist of reasoning:
- "wine can run on Mac"
- I prove that no
- "Macs will disappear".

[ghfick]

I have no idea what your last post attempts to say.
Enough, I guess.
So much this back and forth has been of no value.

[ghfick]

.
Both notations for chains are inconsistent. They deal with bivalue in rc-cell and bilocal in different ways.

DTM [ aka Dennis The Menace ] has repeated this claim of so-called inconsistency on more than one thread. Repeating something over and over does not make it definitive.

Most Sudoku solvers choose to work entirely in the so-called RC view. Most would then see a bi-value cell as different from a bi-local unit.
A bi-local unit exists in a house where only two candidates are present for a particular digit. The pair of cells containing these candidates are called a conjugate pair. The candidates themselves have a strong link, because one of them must be true.

Now, DTM sees everything through the four view spectacles.

The Cambridge dictionary describes an inconsistent argument as containing elements that are opposed and do not match, so that it is difficult to imagine how both can be true. Other dictionaries note inconsistent as incompatible, at odds, conflicting, contradictory, self-contradictory, discrepant.

So if a decision to keep bi-value and bi-local notions separate led to error or contradiction, one could then describe such a decision as inconsistent. Of course, such decision does not result in error or contradiction.

Now it is true that the notation for SudoRules is symmetrical with respect to the four views. Is this symmetry required of a chain notation? Of course not.

[RSW]

I wrote a Sudoku Solver app using a Rapid App Development system (RAD) several years ago. It runs natively on Mac, Linux and Windows. I update it to add new techniques as time permits, but it's certainly nowhere near as complete as YZF_Sudoku. Here is the output from my solver for the puzzle in the OP.


--------

Puzzle: 418..9.......5.......4..3.9..38...6..9....1....2..3.......31..5.3..257.46....4...

1 Solution found. 1.0 ms
418379256379256418256418379143897562897562143562143897784931625931625784625784931

Singles: 3r1c4 -3r2c4 3r2c1 6r8c4 -6r2567c4 6r7c7 -6r12c7 8r9c5 -8r9c2789 -8r3c5 9r2c3 -9r789c3 1r8c3 -1r8c18 -1r9c3

Dense subset: Row 4, (27)r4c6 r4c9 => -2r4c7 -7r4c125
Dense subset: Column 4, (79)r7c4 r9c4 => -7r25c4 -79r6c4
Sparse Subset: Row 9, (2579) r9c2 r9c3 r9c4 r9c7 => -29r9c8 -2r9c9
Box/Line: Row 1/Box 3, (2)r1c7 r1c8 r1c9 => -2r2c789 -2r3c8
Box/Line: Row 1/Box 3, (5)r1c7 r1c8 => -5r3c8
Box/Line: Box 9/Column 8, (8)r7c8 r8c8 => -8r2356c8

Singles: 8r3c6 -8r2c6

Box/Line: Row 3/Box 1, (2)r3c1 r3c2 => -2r2c2

Code: Select all

 +-----------------+--------------+-----------------+
 | 4    1     8    | 3  67    9   | 25   257   267  |
 | 3    67    9    | 12 5     267 | 48   147   1678 |
 | 257  2567  567  | 4  167   8   | 3    17    9    |
 +-----------------+--------------+-----------------+
 | 15   45    3    | 8  149   27  | 459  6     27   |
 | 578  9     4567 | 25 467   267 | 1    23457 2378 |
 | 1578 45678 2    | 15 14679 3   | 4589 4579  78   |
 +-----------------+--------------+-----------------+
 | 2789 2478  47   | 79 3     1   | 6    289   5    |
 | 89   3     1    | 6  2     5   | 7    89    4    |
 | 6    257   57   | 79 8     4   | 29   13    13   |
 +-----------------+--------------+-----------------+


Unique Rectangle (8/9)r78c18 UR+2/1CL (type 4 variant 1): bilocal digit 8 (column 8) => -9r7c1
Unique Rectangle (8/9)r78c18 UR+2/1CL (type 4 variant 1): bilocal digit 9 (column 1) => -8r7c8

Singles: 8r8c8 -8r8c1 9r8c1

Code: Select all

 +-----------------+--------------+-----------------+
 | 4    1     8    | 3  67    9   | 25   257   267  |
 | 3    67    9    | 12 5     267 | 48   147   1678 |
 | 257  2567  567  | 4  167   8   | 3    17    9    |
 +-----------------+--------------+-----------------+
 | 15   45    3    | 8  149   27  | 459  6     27   |
 | 578  9     4567 | 25 467   267 | 1    23457 2378 |
 | 1578 45678 2    | 15 14679 3   | 4589 4579  78   |
 +-----------------+--------------+-----------------+
 | 278  2478  47   | 79 3     1   | 6    29    5    |
 | 9    3     1    | 6  2     5   | 7    8     4    |
 | 6    257   57   | 79 8     4   | 29   13    13   |
 +-----------------+--------------+-----------------+


Finned 2-Fish (aka Finned-X-Wing): Digit 6 in rows 3 6 columns 2 (3) 5, Fin: r3c3
If digit 6 is true in the fin, then it may be eliminated from all other cells in sight of the fin cell. If digit 6 is false in the fin, then the 2-Fish is valid, and digit 6 must go in columns 2 5, and candidate 6 would be invalid in all other cells in columns 2 5
Therefore digit 6 can be eliminated from all cells where it would have been eliminated in either case.
Case B
=> -6r2c2

Singles: 7r2c2 -7r3c123 -7r679c2 -7r2c689

Sparse Subset: Row 3, (256) r3c1 r3c2 r3c3 => -6r3c5
Box/Line: Column 6/Box 5, (7)r4c6 r5c6 => -7r56c5

Code: Select all

 +----------------+-------------+-----------------+
 | 4    1    8    | 3  67   9   | 25   257   267  |
 | 3    7    9    | 12 5    26  | 48   14    168  |
 | 25   256  56   | 4  17   8   | 3    17    9    |
 +----------------+-------------+-----------------+
 | 15   45   3    | 8  149  27  | 459  6     27   |
 | 578  9    4567 | 25 46   267 | 1    23457 2378 |
 | 1578 4568 2    | 15 1469 3   | 4589 4579  78   |
 +----------------+-------------+-----------------+
 | 278  248  47   | 79 3    1   | 6    29    5    |
 | 9    3    1    | 6  2    5   | 7    8     4    |
 | 6    25   57   | 79 8    4   | 29   13    13   |
 +----------------+-------------+-----------------+


Unique Rectangle (2/7)r45c69 UR+2/1CL (type 4 variant 1): bilocal digit 7 (column 6) => -2r5c9

Code: Select all

 +----------------+-------------+----------------+
 | 4    1    8    | 3  67   9   | 25   257   267 |
 | 3    7    9    | 12 5    26  | 48   14    168 |
 | 25   256  56   | 4  17   8   | 3    17    9   |
 +----------------+-------------+----------------+
 | 15   45   3    | 8  149  27  | 459  6     27  |
 | 578  9    4567 | 25 46   267 | 1    23457 378 |
 | 1578 4568 2    | 15 1469 3   | 4589 4579  78  |
 +----------------+-------------+----------------+
 | 278  248  47   | 79 3    1   | 6    29    5   |
 | 9    3    1    | 6  2    5   | 7    8     4   |
 | 6    25   57   | 79 8    4   | 29   13    13  |
 +----------------+-------------+----------------+


ALS(12578)r4567c1 => (5)r6c1=(2)r7c1
(5)r6c1==(2)r7c1-(2=5)r9c2 => -5r46c2

4r4c2
Singles: 4r7c3

Sparse Subset: Column 7, (259) r1c7 r4c7 r9c7 => -59r6c7

Code: Select all

 +--------------+-------------+--------------+
 | 4    1   8   | 3  67   9   | 25 257   267 |
 | 3    7   9   | 12 5    26  | 48 14    168 |
 | 25   256 56  | 4  17   8   | 3  17    9   |
 +--------------+-------------+--------------+
 | 15   4   3   | 8  19   27  | 59 6     27  |
 | 578  9   567 | 25 46   267 | 1  23457 378 |
 | 1578 68  2   | 15 1469 3   | 48 4579  78  |
 +--------------+-------------+--------------+
 | 278  28  4   | 79 3    1   | 6  29    5   |
 | 9    3   1   | 6  2    5   | 7  8     4   |
 | 6    25  57  | 79 8    4   | 29 13    13  |
 +--------------+-------------+--------------+


XY-chain 26: (2=7)r4c9-(7=2)r4c6-(2=5)r5c4-(5=1)r6c4-(1=9)r4c5-(9=5)r4c7-(5=2)r1c7 => -2r1c9

Singles: 2r4c9 -2r4c6 -2r5c8 7r4c6 -7r5c6

Dense subset: Row 1, (67)r1c5 r1c9 => -7r1c8

Code: Select all

 +--------------+-------------+--------------+
 | 4    1   8   | 3  67   9   | 25 257   267 |
 | 3    7   9   | 12 5    26  | 48 14    168 |
 | 25   256 56  | 4  17   8   | 3  17    9   |
 +--------------+-------------+--------------+
 | 15   4   3   | 8  19   27  | 59 6     27  |
 | 578  9   567 | 25 46   267 | 1  23457 378 |
 | 1578 68  2   | 15 1469 3   | 48 4579  78  |
 +--------------+-------------+--------------+
 | 278  28  4   | 79 3    1   | 6  29    5   |
 | 9    3   1   | 6  2    5   | 7  8     4   |
 | 6    25  57  | 79 8    4   | 29 13    13  |
 +--------------+-------------+--------------+


XY-chain 55: (2=5)r9c2-(5=7)r9c3-(7=9)r9c4-(9=2)r9c7-(2=5)r1c7-(5=9)r4c7-(9=1)r4c5-(1=5)r4c1-(5=2)r3c1 => -2r7c1 -2r3c2

Singles: 2r3c1

Box/Line: Column 1/Box 4, (5)r4c1 r5c1 r6c1 => -5r5c3

Code: Select all

 +--------------+-------------+--------------+
 | 4    1   8   | 3  67   9   | 25 257   267 |
 | 3    7   9   | 12 5    26  | 48 14    168 |
 | 25   256 56  | 4  17   8   | 3  17    9   |
 +--------------+-------------+--------------+
 | 15   4   3   | 8  19   27  | 59 6     27  |
 | 578  9   567 | 25 46   267 | 1  23457 378 |
 | 1578 68  2   | 15 1469 3   | 48 4579  78  |
 +--------------+-------------+--------------+
 | 278  28  4   | 79 3    1   | 6  29    5   |
 | 9    3   1   | 6  2    5   | 7  8     4   |
 | 6    25  57  | 79 8    4   | 29 13    13  |
 +--------------+-------------+--------------+


XY-chain 15: (5=9)r4c7-(9=1)r4c5-(1=5)r6c4 => -5r6c8

Code: Select all

 +--------------+-------------+--------------+
 | 4    1   8   | 3  67   9   | 25 257   267 |
 | 3    7   9   | 12 5    26  | 48 14    168 |
 | 25   256 56  | 4  17   8   | 3  17    9   |
 +--------------+-------------+--------------+
 | 15   4   3   | 8  19   27  | 59 6     27  |
 | 578  9   567 | 25 46   267 | 1  23457 378 |
 | 1578 68  2   | 15 1469 3   | 48 4579  78  |
 +--------------+-------------+--------------+
 | 278  28  4   | 79 3    1   | 6  29    5   |
 | 9    3   1   | 6  2    5   | 7  8     4   |
 | 6    25  57  | 79 8    4   | 29 13    13  |
 +--------------+-------------+--------------+


XY-chain 35: (6=8)r6c2-(8=2)r7c2-(2=9)r7c8-(9=2)r9c7-(2=5)r1c7-(5=9)r4c7-(9=1)r4c5-(1=7)r3c5-(7=6)r1c5 => -6r6c5

Singles: 6r6c2 -6r3c2 -6r5c3 5r3c2 -5r9c2 -5r3c3 2r9c2 -2r7c2 -2r9c7 8r7c2 -8r7c1 7r7c1 -7r56c1 -7r9c3 -7r7c4 9r7c4 -9r9c4 -9r7c8 7r9c4 2r7c8 -2r1c8 5r1c8 -5r1c7 -5r5c8 2r1c7 5r9c3 9r9c7 -9r4c7 5r4c7 -5r4c1 1r4c1 -1r6c1 -1r4c5 9r4c5 -9r6c5 6r3c3 7r5c3 -7r5c89 9r6c8 7r6c9 -7r1c9 6r1c9 -6r1c5 -6r2c9 7r1c5 -7r3c5 1r3c5 -1r2c4 -1r6c5 -1r3c8 4r6c5 -4r5c5 -4r6c7 6r5c5 -6r5c6 2r5c6 -2r5c4 -2r2c6 6r2c6 5r5c4 -5r5c1 -5r6c4 1r6c4 8r5c1 -8r6c1 -8r5c9 5r6c1 3r5c9 -3r5c8 -3r9c9 1r9c9 -1r9c8 -1r2c9 8r2c9 -8r2c7 4r2c7 -4r2c8 1r2c8 3r9c8 4r5c8 8r6c7 7r3c8 2r2c4

---Solved---

It automatically encloses the PM grids in code tags to make it easy to paste into forum posts. However the PM grids are not annotated. That's on my to do list.

What it refers to as dense and sparse subsets are normal locked sets. Dense refers to sets where each cell contains all candidates, and sparse refers to all the others.

I haven't made this software available anywhere, because I don't want to become responsible for maintaining it, but I find it useful for my own purposes.

[1to9only]

Stormdoku is written in Turbo Pascal ...

A couple years ago, I compiled Stormdoku using Free Pascal with "Supported operating systems include Windows (16/32/64 bit, CE, and native NT), Linux, Mac OS X/iOS/iPhoneSimulator/Darwin, FreeBSD and other BSD flavors, DOS (16 bit, or 32 bit DPMI), OS/2, AIX, Android, Haiku, Nintendo GBA/DS/Wii, AmigaOS, MorphOS, AROS, Atari TOS, and various embedded platforms."

[jco]

: Off topic :
Edit: removed and posted in the puzzle section.

[denis_berthier]

I wrote a Sudoku Solver app using a Rapid App Development system (RAD) several years ago. It runs natively on Mac, Linux and Windows. I update it to add new techniques as time permits, but it's certainly nowhere near as complete as YZF_Sudoku.

It's always interesting to have reports of real work. I have a few technical questions.
1) When you say "RAD system", are you talking of applying a RAD methodology or of using RAD tools (that automatically produce target code).
2) What's the target language (i.e., depending on the answer to question 1, the language of the code written manually or of the code produced by the RAD tools) ?
3) Does your software include a GUI and if yes, how do you or the RAD manage the different graphic libraries on Mac, Linux and Windows?
4) Does it still work with the recent versions of MacOS that have much higher security requirements?

Unrelated, but interesting in the present context:
5) Considering your experience in portable software, what do you think of making a system written in Visual Basic run on Unix/MacOS?
.

[ghfick]

It's always interesting to have reports of real work.
.

"REAL" work, eh? Dennis The Menace has to make an implied criticism of others. Dennis The Menace should stick to his own work. DTM is not entitled to comment about absolutely everyone else's submissions. DTM needs to stop abducting this forum.

RSW does not have any obligation to respond to Dennis The Menace.

btw RSW's new solver looks very promising. It looks like RSW has features in mind that are not seen in other software. YZF_Sudoku is, indeed, the most up-to-date software. I have been assisting YZF for some time now. I wrote a short introduction for his software [ which is posted in the YZF_Sudoku thread ] and my role has been largely as editor of English matters and making suggestions to YZF for additions and changes.

[denis_berthier]

It's always interesting to have reports of real work.

"REAL" work, eh? Dennis The Menace has to make an implied criticism of others. Dennis The Menace should stick to his own work. DTM is not entitled to comment about absolutely everyone else's submissions. DTM needs to stop abducting this forum.

Who are you to say who has the right or not to post on this forum? Who here is obviously trying to abduct this forum?

BTW, your post has been reported. It's time you stop all this.

[ghfick]

BTW, your post has been reported. It's time you stop all this.

I presume you have reported to the moderator. We will see who might be reprimanded. I have taken a stand. It is YOU who must stop all this.

[ghfick]

I am gratified to note the many PMs and emails I have recently received. All unanimous in their condemnation of DTM.
Here are some edited ancedotes:

"[I have been...] cheering you (and eleven) on."

"The sheer arrogance with which [DTM] has endeavored to take over the forum is disgusting"

"Anybody seen as an obstacle to [DTM] is an enemy. (Eleven, YZF.. you, me,...)

"I also hate that [DTM] is looking for presence in the forum at all times, and I [will] not respond to his posts in the future"

[ghfick]

The moderator's last post appears to be from 2021. I would note that g.r.emlin is still unavailable to the Patterns Game participants. There have been no Patterns Games since May of 2022.
However, I would welcome intervention by the moderator. It is DTM who began and has perpetuated this recent thread. I am taking a stand. I am encouraged by so many others and so I will continue to take this stand.

[ghfick]

I have submitted a report to the moderator. DTM referred to me as ghf*ck. That is only part of his abuse. I just referred to the forum guidelines page. DTM has clearly been abusive and harassing to me and to numerous others.