The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Everything about Sudoku that doesn't fit in one of the other sections

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby 999_Springs » Wed Jun 16, 2021 12:37 am

thanks to 1to9only for the clarifications and the ranking of the patterns game 11.7's and 11.8's by node count of the longest chain. i look forward to seeing the results from the 11.9's soon :), as i believe that the node count of the longest chain is a more natural SE tiebreaker than EP/ED since the length is what SE uses to assign ratings anyway

1to9only wrote:[g.r.emlin flags the ED=11.8/11.8/3.4 as the 2nd posted with that rating! I cannot find the 1st one!!]

gremlin crashed a few times immediately after the game was finished. you can see from the close of game 169 that mike's 20 11.8 and strmckr's 20 11.6, posted by gsf and champagne respectively, are both marked as "rare-0" at the end of the game, but after gremlin crashed multiple times over the next few days, they turned into "rare-1" in the results thread. the crash was because both mike and coloin submitted the same 20 clue pattern one after another and gremlin validated both of them when they PMed it, so they both ended up in the queue, which somehow made gremlin immediately replay the whole game, meaning the puzzles were counted twice in the rarity statistics

mith, 1to9only posted an extensive list of chain lengths and types for all patterns game puzzles here. it contains a 10.2 dynamic (+) example, as well as an 8.2 nishio and an 8.8 multiple fc which you may also be interested in. and i got there first with the minimal 31-clue 11.1 here ;)
999_Springs
 
Posts: 591
Joined: 27 January 2007
Location: In the toilet, flushing down springs, one by one.

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby coloin » Wed Jun 16, 2021 2:56 am

Thanks for that i didnt know those details !

Whilst we are at it ... I would like to record the only time the dealer [me] has actually won a patterns game.
In game 086 the highest rating puzzle [a 11.4] was not found by the players and was posted after the game finished ....
Unfortuately it wasnt credited with a :::more::: submission. :D
coloin
 
Posts: 2494
Joined: 05 May 2005
Location: Devon

The 11.8 and 11.9 grids from ph_2010

Postby 1to9only » Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:56 am

The 11.8 and 11.9 grids are from ph_2010, in the (hidden) lists below, they appear in ER/EP/ED rating order. Within each grid, the number of nodes are in sorted order (i.e. they may NOT appear in the same order in the solution path). Each grid solution path takes about 8-9 minutes of SE run!!

Highest Rated: ED=11.8/11.8/11.7
With Most 11.8 Steps [10]: ED=11.8/1.5/1.5
Longest Chain: ED=11.8/11.8/3.4, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/369 nodes)
11.8s from ph_2010: Show
Code: Select all
.......12......345..3..46....2..1.3..7..6....8..9.......5..2..4.6..8....9..7..... ED=11.8/11.8/11.7 dob;12_12_03;248083;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/291 nodes)
.......12......345..3..46....2..1.3..7..6....8..9.......5..2..4.6..8....9..7..... ED=11.8/11.8/11.7 dob;12_12_03;248083;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/288 nodes)

1....6.8....7..1........5.6..9.4.....7.2...3.8....76..3....1..5.4.9.......2.7.... ED=11.8/11.8/11.6 elev;16;8;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/339 nodes)
1....6.8....7..1........5.6..9.4.....7.2...3.8....76..3....1..5.4.9.......2.7.... ED=11.8/11.8/11.6 elev;16;8;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/329 nodes)

1.......9..67...2..8....4......75.3...5..2....6.3......9....8..6...4...1..25...6. ED=11.8/11.8/11.6 elev;15;7;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/328 nodes)
1.......9..67...2..8....4......75.3...5..2....6.3......9....8..6...4...1..25...6. ED=11.8/11.8/11.6 elev;15;7;22; 11.8, Double Forcing Chain (w/273 nodes)

98.76....54.........7..59..4....75.....3...2.....1...6.9...87....4....1....2....3 ED=11.8/11.8/11.5 GP;kz1a;15497;23; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/288 nodes)

.2...67..4...8......93........9..57..1...7..2......61.3...4..6...8.......6...5.2. ED=11.8/11.8/11.5 tarekdb;tarx0075;9;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/300 nodes)
.2...67..4...8......93........9..57..1...7..2......61.3...4..6...8.......6...5.2. ED=11.8/11.8/11.5 tarekdb;tarx0075;9;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/283 nodes)

98.7.....6...5......4..93..5......6..7..8......9..24....1.....4....9.1.......1.32 ED=11.8/11.8/11.4 GP;H1;11;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/316 nodes)
98.7.....6...5......4..93..5......6..7..8......9..24....1.....4....9.1.......1.32 ED=11.8/11.8/11.4 GP;H1;11;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/261 nodes)

2.......6.5..8..1...4...9...7.3.1......82.......7.5.3...9...4...8..1..5.6.......2 ED=11.8/11.8/11.4 tax;tarek-ultra-0203;10;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/263 nodes)

1.......2..94...5..6....7.....89..4....3.6.....8.4.....2....1..7.......6..5.8..3. ED=11.8/11.8/11.2 tax;gsf-2007-05-24-003 64879;12;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/290 nodes)
1.......2..94...5..6....7.....89..4....3.6.....8.4.....2....1..7.......6..5.8..3. ED=11.8/11.8/11.2 tax;gsf-2007-05-24-003 64879;12;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/266 nodes)

6.......2.9.4...5...1...7...5..84.......2.......3.5.4.2.....6...3...9.8...7.....1 ED=11.8/11.8/11.1 tax;coloin-04-10;13;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/280 nodes)
6.......2.9.4...5...1...7...5..84.......2.......3.5.4.2.....6...3...9.8...7.....1 ED=11.8/11.8/11.1 tax;coloin-04-10;13;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/264 nodes)
6.......2.9.4...5...1...7...5..84.......2.......3.5.4.2.....6...3...9.8...7.....1 ED=11.8/11.8/11.1 tax;coloin-04-10;13;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/261 nodes)
6.......2.9.4...5...1...7...5..84.......2.......3.5.4.2.....6...3...9.8...7.....1 ED=11.8/11.8/11.1 tax;coloin-04-10;13;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/260 nodes)

1.......2.9.4...5...6...7...5.3.4.......6........58.4...2...6...3...9.8.7.......1 ED=11.8/11.8/10.8 tax;coloin-04-10;14;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/277 nodes)
1.......2.9.4...5...6...7...5.3.4.......6........58.4...2...6...3...9.8.7.......1 ED=11.8/11.8/10.8 tax;coloin-04-10;14;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/269 nodes)

...4...89..7..92......3...526...1.....19.....7.....1..5...9..4...6..29.....8....3 ED=11.8/11.8/10.7 elev;17;15;23; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/331 nodes)
...4...89..7..92......3...526...1.....19.....7.....1..5...9..4...6..29.....8....3 ED=11.8/11.8/10.7 elev;17;15;23; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/316 nodes)
...4...89..7..92......3...526...1.....19.....7.....1..5...9..4...6..29.....8....3 ED=11.8/11.8/10.7 elev;17;15;23; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/299 nodes)

..1.....2.3...4.5.6...2.7.......5.....8.7.1...9.3.......7.6...8.4.....9.8.....2.. ED=11.8/11.8/10.7 SSX;2019_3_5;2316170;21; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/276 nodes)

98.7.....7...6.9....5....4..9.3..8....2.....1.....4.5..3..7.6.....8...7......1..2 ED=11.8/11.8/10.6 PAQ;2019_03_18;2320323;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/295 nodes)

........94....92......7..45..1.3.....7.6..9..8....7..2.3.7..8....6.1....9....5.2. ED=11.8/11.8/10.5 elev;18;16;23; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/276 nodes)

........1.....2.3...4.5.6....7.8.....1......96..4..7....85.....59...3.2.7...6.5.. ED=11.8/11.8/10.5 dob;12_12_03;248027;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/317 nodes)
........1.....2.3...4.5.6....7.8.....1......96..4..7....85.....59...3.2.7...6.5.. ED=11.8/11.8/10.5 dob;12_12_03;248027;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/311 nodes)
........1.....2.3...4.5.6....7.8.....1......96..4..7....85.....59...3.2.7...6.5.. ED=11.8/11.8/10.5 dob;12_12_03;248027;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/305 nodes)
........1.....2.3...4.5.6....7.8.....1......96..4..7....85.....59...3.2.7...6.5.. ED=11.8/11.8/10.5 dob;12_12_03;248027;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/281 nodes)
........1.....2.3...4.5.6....7.8.....1......96..4..7....85.....59...3.2.7...6.5.. ED=11.8/11.8/10.5 dob;12_12_03;248027;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/275 nodes)
........1.....2.3...4.5.6....7.8.....1......96..4..7....85.....59...3.2.7...6.5.. ED=11.8/11.8/10.5 dob;12_12_03;248027;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/274 nodes)
........1.....2.3...4.5.6....7.8.....1......96..4..7....85.....59...3.2.7...6.5.. ED=11.8/11.8/10.5 dob;12_12_03;248027;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/268 nodes)

1.......2.3.4...5...6...7...5.9.4.......23......8...9...2...6...9...8.4.7.......1 ED=11.8/11.8/10.4 Hp54;1;18;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/276 nodes)
1.......2.3.4...5...6...7...5.9.4.......23......8...9...2...6...9...8.4.7.......1 ED=11.8/11.8/10.4 Hp54;1;18;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/264 nodes)
1.......2.3.4...5...6...7...5.8.4.......29......3...9...7.....1.9...8.4.2.....6.. ED=11.8/11.8/10.4 Hp54;4;17;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/263 nodes)

.2...1......6...3...9.8...7..5....78.3.....6.8...4.5....4.9.7...1.2.....9.......5 ED=11.8/11.8/10.0 col;2015_08;1682984;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/266 nodes)

...4...8...7..92......3...526...1.....19......7....1..5......4..1.8....3..6..29.. ED=11.8/11.8/9.9  elev;9;19;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/288 nodes)

.2.4..7....6.....17...3......5....6..4.2..9.......5..8..1..8....9..7.......92.3.. ED=11.8/11.8/9.8  elev;10;20;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/332 nodes)
.2.4..7....6.....17...3......5....6..4.2..9.......5..8..1..8....9..7.......92.3.. ED=11.8/11.8/9.8  elev;10;20;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/325 nodes)
.2.4..7....6.....17...3......5....6..4.2..9.......5..8..1..8....9..7.......92.3.. ED=11.8/11.8/9.8  elev;10;20;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/307 nodes)
.2.4..7....6.....17...3......5....6..4.2..9.......5..8..1..8....9..7.......92.3.. ED=11.8/11.8/9.8  elev;10;20;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/282 nodes)
.2.4..7....6.....17...3......5....6..4.2..9.......5..8..1..8....9..7.......92.3.. ED=11.8/11.8/9.8  elev;10;20;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/275 nodes)

.......12.....3..4..2.4.5....4.5..2..6....7..8..9..4....7.1...5.3...8...9..6..... ED=11.8/11.8/9.4  dob;12_12_03;247933;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/329 nodes)
.......12.....3..4..2.4.5....4.5..2..6....7..8..9..4....7.1...5.3...8...9..6..... ED=11.8/11.8/9.4  dob;12_12_03;247933;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/303 nodes)

........1.....2.3...4.5.6.......1.2....3.7..8.6..9.7...598......76..5...4...7.5.. ED=11.8/11.8/8.3  dob;12_12_17s;762567;23; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/269 nodes)

1.......9.5....2....87...4.2...3......48.5....8.6...7...6..4.5.........1....9.3.. ED=11.8/11.8/7.9  elev;11;21;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/300 nodes)

..3.8....7..2......6...9.1.........3.....596..9.....54.1...45..8...3......27..... ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  tax;tarek071223170000-;23;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/280 nodes)
..3.8....7..2......6...9.1.........3.....596..9.....54.1...45..8...3......27..... ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  tax;tarek071223170000-;23;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/279 nodes)
..3.8....7..2......6...9.1.........3.....596..9.....54.1...45..8...3......27..... ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  tax;tarek071223170000-;23;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/264 nodes)

1.......6.5.7...8...3...4.....5.8.9.....3.....8.92....6.....3...7...5.2...4.....1 ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  col;H1;24;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/285 nodes)
1.......6.5.7...8...3...4.....5.8.9.....3.....8.92....6.....3...7...5.2...4.....1 ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  col;H1;24;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/276 nodes)
1.......6.5.7...8...3...4.....5.8.9.....3.....8.92....6.....3...7...5.2...4.....1 ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  col;H1;24;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/267 nodes)

5.......9.2.1...7...8...3...4.6.........5.......2.7.1...3...8...6...4.2.9.......5 ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  tax;m_b_metcalf;22;20; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/369 nodes)
5.......9.2.1...7...8...3...4.6.........5.......2.7.1...3...8...6...4.2.9.......5 ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  tax;m_b_metcalf;22;20; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/347 nodes)
5.......9.2.1...7...8...3...4.6.........5.......2.7.1...3...8...6...4.2.9.......5 ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  tax;m_b_metcalf;22;20; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/337 nodes)
5.......9.2.1...7...8...3...4.6.........5.......2.7.1...3...8...6...4.2.9.......5 ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  tax;m_b_metcalf;22;20; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/321 nodes)
5.......9.2.1...7...8...3...4.6.........5.......2.7.1...3...8...6...4.2.9.......5 ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  tax;m_b_metcalf;22;20; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/318 nodes)

........1..2..3.4..4..5.6......1.5.....6....78....4.3..8...9.2.2.37.....9...2.... ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  dob;12_12_03;247946;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/315 nodes)

98.76....75....9....6......8...4..3..2......1..95..8....86..5......3...4.....1.2. ED=11.8/11.8/3.4  GP;KZ1C;23862;23; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/338 nodes)

98.7.....7.....9....2.95...47........3.4..7....6....1....84.3.......6..2.....2..1 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  col;2015_08;1682994;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/343 nodes)
98.7.....7.....9....2.95...47........3.4..7....6....1....84.3.......6..2.....2..1 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  col;2015_08;1682994;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/304 nodes)
98.7.....7.....9....2.95...47........3.4..7....6....1....84.3.......6..2.....2..1 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  col;2015_08;1682994;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/290 nodes)

98.7.....76..8......5......8..9..4....3....2......1..5...46.7......9.6.2.....2.34 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  PAQ;2019_05_01;2346393;23; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/282 nodes)

1......8......92....6.3...52....8.....5.7.....6.5....4..47...........91..3..6...7 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  elev;14;28;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/286 nodes)
1......8......92....6.3...52....8.....5.7.....6.5....4..47...........91..3..6...7 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  elev;14;28;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/286 nodes)
1......8......92....6.3...52....8.....5.7.....6.5....4..47...........91..3..6...7 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  elev;14;28;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/271 nodes)

..34...8.......1.37........2...9.......5..8...6...7.4...51....8.7...5...9...62.5. ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  elev;13;27;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/289 nodes)

98.7.....6..89......5..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......1.4.........2 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  GP;H3;26;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/287 nodes)
98.7.....6..89......5..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......1.4.........2 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  GP;H3;26;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/259 nodes)

........1.....2.3....14.5....3.....6.5.7..4..8.......2..6..8..5.4.51.....9..7.1.. ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  dob;2012_11_10;225581;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/291 nodes)
........1.....2.3....14.5....3.....6.5.7..4..8.......2..6..8..5.4.51.....9..7.1.. ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  dob;2012_11_10;225581;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/272 nodes)

98.7.....6..89......5..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....41.6..8.3.......1..5.......2. ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  GP;H2;25;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/261 nodes)

98.7.....6..89......1..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  col;2012_11_10;225580;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/290 nodes)
98.7.....6..89......1..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  col;2012_11_10;225580;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/263 nodes)
98.7.....6..89......1..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  col;2012_11_10;225580;22; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/260 nodes)
98.7.....6..89......1..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  col;2012_11_10;225580;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/259 nodes)

.....9.......8..76...7...85..5.....7.9.....5.1....23...1...4...34..9......681.... ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  MITH;2020_10;3269469;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/302 nodes)
.....9.......8..76...7...85..5.....7.9.....5.1....23...1...4...34..9......681.... ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  MITH;2020_10;3269469;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/289 nodes)
.....9.......8..76...7...85..5.....7.9.....5.1....23...1...4...34..9......681.... ED=11.8/11.8/2.6  MITH;2020_10;3269469;22; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/273 nodes)

68.7.....3..89......5..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......1.4.........2 ED=11.8/1.5/1.5   col;2012_11_10;225579;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/358 nodes)
68.7.....3..89......5..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......1.4.........2 ED=11.8/1.5/1.5   col;2012_11_10;225579;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/352 nodes)
68.7.....3..89......1..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.8/1.5/1.5   col;2012_11_10;225578;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/350 nodes)
68.7.....3..89......1..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.8/1.5/1.5   col;2012_11_10;225578;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/349 nodes)
68.7.....3..89......5..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......1.4.........2 ED=11.8/1.5/1.5   col;2012_11_10;225579;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/349 nodes)
68.7.....3..89......1..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.8/1.5/1.5   col;2012_11_10;225578;22; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/333 nodes)
68.7.....3..89......1..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.8/1.5/1.5   col;2012_11_10;225578;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/331 nodes)
68.7.....3..89......1..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.8/1.5/1.5   col;2012_11_10;225578;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/316 nodes)
68.7.....3..89......5..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......1.4.........2 ED=11.8/1.5/1.5   col;2012_11_10;225579;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/286 nodes)
68.7.....3..89......1..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.8/1.5/1.5   col;2012_11_10;225578;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/273 nodes)

..12..3......4..5......6...2.....1.3.4.....6.1.7.....8.1.7......9..65...7..8..2.. ED=11.8/1.5/1.5   MITH;2020_10;3268347;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/308 nodes)
..12..3......4..5......6...2.....1.3.4.....6.1.7.....8.1.7......9..65...7..8..2.. ED=11.8/1.5/1.5   MITH;2020_10;3268347;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/272 nodes)

5.6...7...1.3.....7...5.8.....1...2.....7.6.8.....214.8...9...6.3...4.....5...... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   OW;Lightsaber;1682979;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/332 nodes)
5.6...7...1.3.....7...5.8.....1...2.....7.6.8.....214.8...9...6.3...4.....5...... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   OW;Lightsaber;1682979;22; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/317 nodes)
5.6...7...1.3.....7...5.8.....1...2.....7.6.8.....214.8...9...6.3...4.....5...... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   OW;Lightsaber;1682979;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/291 nodes)
5.6...7...1.3.....7...5.8.....1...2.....7.6.8.....214.8...9...6.3...4.....5...... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   OW;Lightsaber;1682979;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/290 nodes)
5.6...7...1.3.....7...5.8.....1...2.....7.6.8.....214.8...9...6.3...4.....5...... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   OW;Lightsaber;1682979;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/284 nodes)
5.6...7...1.3.....7...5.8.....1...2.....7.6.8.....214.8...9...6.3...4.....5...... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   OW;Lightsaber;1682979;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/283 nodes)
5.6...7...1.3.....7...5.8.....1...2.....7.6.8.....214.8...9...6.3...4.....5...... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   OW;Lightsaber;1682979;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/275 nodes)
5.6...7...1.3.....7...5.8.....1...2.....7.6.8.....214.8...9...6.3...4.....5...... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   OW;Lightsaber;1682979;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/265 nodes)

.......12.....3..4..1.4.5....2.6..5..7....6..8..9..4....4.1...5.3.8.....9....7... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   dob;12_12_03;262544;22; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/307 nodes)

98.7.......6.5.4.........9.3..9..2...7..8...9..9..5.4.2..5....3..1.6..5......1... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   GP;12_07;38140;23; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/291 nodes)
98.7.......6.5.4.........9.3..9..2...7..8...9..9..5.4.2..5....3..1.6..5......1... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   GP;12_07;38140;23; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/264 nodes)

98.7..6....5.96........4.9.87..6.9....3.........8....246...87......7.4.........1. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   PAQ;2018_11_28;2123940;23; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/282 nodes)
98.7..6....5.96........4.9.87..6.9....3.........8....246...87......7.4.........1. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   PAQ;2018_11_28;2123940;23; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/282 nodes)

98.76.5..7..4..6....3..8...5..6..4......2...........1.4...7...9.5....7.....5...64 ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   PAQ;2019_04_28;2345625;23; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/257 nodes)
98.76.5..7..4..6....3..8...5..6..4......2...........1.4...7...9.5....7.....5...64 ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   PAQ;2019_04_28;2345625;23; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/257 nodes)

98.76.5..7.54..6....3..8...5..6..4......2...........1.4...7..59...5...64......7.. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   PAQ;2019_04_28;2345626;24; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/257 nodes)
98.76.5..7.54..6....3..8...5..6..4......2...........1.4...7..59...5...64......7.. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   PAQ;2019_04_28;2345626;24; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/257 nodes)

98.7.......7.6.........57..4...3..2..1...6..3...9..8..2......4..3......1..86..5.. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   GP;cy4;9253;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/277 nodes)

.2....78.4.......6.9..7..1....5....3.....1.......9.12..7..1.8..5....4.....67.3... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;7;29;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/259 nodes)

.....6.8....1..2...9..7...5..5.4...734...8...97.........9...6..7...3...4...2...1. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;5;30;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/318 nodes)
.....6.8....1..2...9..7...5..5.4...734...8...97.........9...6..7...3...4...2...1. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;5;30;22; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/311 nodes)

.....6..94...8.2.....7...1.2.9...8....4.3.9...6.....5.3.8.4.......5......7...1... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;4;31;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/301 nodes)
.....6..94...8.2.....7...1.2.9...8....4.3.9...6.....5.3.8.4.......5......7...1... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;4;31;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/280 nodes)
.....6..94...8.2.....7...1.2.9...8....4.3.9...6.....5.3.8.4.......5......7...1... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;4;31;21; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/267 nodes)
.....6..94...8.2.....7...1.2.9...8....4.3.9...6.....5.3.8.4.......5......7...1... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;4;31;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/260 nodes)
.....6..94...8.2.....7...1.2.9...8....4.3.9...6.....5.3.8.4.......5......7...1... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;4;31;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/259 nodes)

1....6.......8.2...9.7....5.7.3...5......16....4....73..59....48...2.....3....... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;L1;32;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/257 nodes)

..3..6.8....1......9..7...4...8..6..3...4...2.....5.1...2.9...37........94....5.. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;6;33;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/264 nodes)
..3..6.8....1......9..7...4...8..6..3...4...2.....5.1...2.9...37........94....5.. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;6;33;21; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/267 nodes)

.2.4..7...5...9.3.6...7......5..8.9.7...2.....4.6..3.......1..85......1...1...9.3 ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;8;34;23; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/306 nodes)
.2.4..7...5...9.3.6...7......5..8.9.7...2.....4.6..3.......1..85......1...1...9.3 ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   elev;8;34;23; 11.8, Cell Forcing Chains (w/279 nodes)

........1.....2.3....45.6....1.7...2.8.6..7..67.........3..9...4..5..8..85.7..... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   dob;12_12_17s;762565;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/275 nodes)

........1..2..3.4..3..5.6......6...7..8..2.3..7.1..5....9.2...3.8...9...4......9. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   dob;12_12_03;248311;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/296 nodes)

.......12.....3..4..4.2.5....2.6...5.7....6..8..9.......6.1..5..9...8...3..7.6... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   dob;12_12_03;247938;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/291 nodes)
.......12.....3..4..4.2.5....2.6...5.7....6..8..9.......6.1..5..9...8...3..7.6... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   dob;12_12_03;247938;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/288 nodes)

.......12.....3..4..2.4.5....1....5..3.6.....7....8.....4.2...5.6.3..9..8....7... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   dob;12_12_03;247926;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/304 nodes)

........1.....2.3...4.5.6...3.....72.4....8..6..8..9...7...1...4.56.....8..59.... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   dob;12_12_03;247964;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/356 nodes)
........1.....2.3...4.5.6...3.....72.4....8..6..8..9...7...1...4.56.....8..59.... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   dob;12_12_03;247964;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/298 nodes)
........1.....2.3...4.5.6...3.....72.4....8..6..8..9...7...1...4.56.....8..59.... ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   dob;12_12_03;247964;22; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/277 nodes)

9..8..7...8..6......5....4.6...9.....3.7..9.......2..5.9..3.8....4.....1.....1.2. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   GP;2012_04;32976;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/311 nodes)
9..8..7...8..6......5....4.6...9.....3.7..9.......2..5.9..3.8....4.....1.....1.2. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   GP;2012_04;32976;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/310 nodes)
9..8..7...8..6......5....4.6...9.....3.7..9.......2..5.9..3.8....4.....1.....1.2. ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   GP;2012_04;32976;21; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/296 nodes)

98.7..6....5.4...........9.8..9...6..4..5...9..9..32..1.........7.1...8...8..2..3 ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   GP;12_05;35497;23; 11.8, Region Forcing Chains (w/291 nodes)
98.7..6....5.4...........9.8..9...6..4..5...9..9..32..1.........7.1...8...8..2..3 ED=11.8/1.2/1.2   GP;12_05;35497;23; 11.8, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/264 nodes)


Highest Rated: ED=11.9/11.9/11.8
With Most 11.9 Steps [5]: ED=11.9/11.9/2.6
Longest Chain: ED=11.9/1.2/1.2, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/472 nodes)
11.9s from ph_2010: Show
Code: Select all
98.7.....7.....6....6.5.....4...5.3...79..5......2...1..85..9......1...4.....3.2. ED=11.9/11.9/11.8 GP;champagne dry;1;22; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/467 nodes)
98.7.....7.....6....6.5.....4...5.3...79..5......2...1..85..9......1...4.....3.2. ED=11.9/11.9/11.8 GP;champagne dry;1;22; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/446 nodes)
98.7.....7.....6....6.5.....4...5.3...79..5......2...1..85..9......1...4.....3.2. ED=11.9/11.9/11.8 GP;champagne dry;1;22; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/434 nodes)
98.7.....7.....6....6.5.....4...5.3...79..5......2...1..85..9......1...4.....3.2. ED=11.9/11.9/11.8 GP;champagne dry;1;22; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/398 nodes)

98.7.....6.....87...7.....5.4..3.5....65...9......2..1..86...5.....1.3.......4..2 ED=11.9/11.9/11.6 GP;kz0;11523;23; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/395 nodes)

12..3....4....1.2...52..1..5..4..2......6..7......3..8.5....9....9.7..3......8..6 ED=11.9/11.9/11.3 elev;second flush;2;23; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/386 nodes)

.......39.....1..5..3.5.8....8.9...6.7...2...1..4.......9.8..5..2....6..4..7..... ED=11.9/11.9/11.3 tax;Golden-Nugget;3;21; 11.9, Region Forcing Chains (w/417 nodes)
.......39.....1..5..3.5.8....8.9...6.7...2...1..4.......9.8..5..2....6..4..7..... ED=11.9/11.9/11.3 tax;Golden-Nugget;3;21; 11.9, Region Forcing Chains (w/397 nodes)
.......39.....1..5..3.5.8....8.9...6.7...2...1..4.......9.8..5..2....6..4..7..... ED=11.9/11.9/11.3 tax;Golden-Nugget;3;21; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/386 nodes)

.2.4...8.....8...68....71..2..5...9..95.......4..3.........1..7..28...4.....6.3.. ED=11.9/11.9/9.9  elev;3;4;22; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/397 nodes)

........1....23.45..51..2....25...1..6...27..8...9......42....7.3...6...9...8.... ED=11.9/11.9/9.9  dob;12_12_03;248078;23; 11.9, Cell Forcing Chains (w/389 nodes)

12.3.....4.5...6...7.....2.6..1..3....453.........8..9...45.1.........8......2..7 ED=11.9/11.9/2.6  elev;1;5;22; 11.9, Cell Forcing Chains (w/432 nodes)
12.3.....4.5...6...7.....2.6..1..3....453.........8..9...45.1.........8......2..7 ED=11.9/11.9/2.6  elev;1;5;22; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/422 nodes)
12.3.....4.5...6...7.....2.6..1..3....453.........8..9...45.1.........8......2..7 ED=11.9/11.9/2.6  elev;1;5;22; 11.9, Cell Forcing Chains (w/414 nodes)
12.3.....4.5...6...7.....2.6..1..3....453.........8..9...45.1.........8......2..7 ED=11.9/11.9/2.6  elev;1;5;22; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/395 nodes)
12.3.....4.5...6...7.....2.6..1..3....453.........8..9...45.1.........8......2..7 ED=11.9/11.9/2.6  elev;1;5;22; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/393 nodes)

5.6...7...1.3.....8...5.9.....1...2.....8.6.7.....2.4.7...9...6.3...42....5...... ED=11.9/1.2/1.2   OW;2015_08;1744614;22; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/472 nodes)

..3..6.8....1..2......7...4..9..8.6..3..4...1.7.2.....3....5.....5...6..98.....5. ED=11.9/1.2/1.2   elev;2;6;22; 11.9, Contradiction Forcing Chain (w/397 nodes)


Edit: All the grids shown are the starting grids, not necessarily the state of the grid just before the step shown is made.
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1to9only
 
Posts: 4177
Joined: 04 April 2018

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby mith » Wed Jun 23, 2021 10:06 pm

Pushing the +DFC minimal limits:

Code: Select all
29c
........1.......2.....345....65.7..3.45.63....7.84.....57..6...48.3.56..6.347.8..  ED=11.6/1.2/1.2


There is one minimal 28c from this which will presumably have the same rating (hasn't run yet):

Code: Select all
28c
........1.......2.....345....364.....7.5.8..345..7.....3748.6..58...7...6.43.57..  ED=11.6/1.2/1.2


[edit]28c confirmed now[/edit]
Last edited by mith on Wed Jun 23, 2021 10:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
mith
 
Posts: 996
Joined: 14 July 2020

Re: The 11.8 and 11.9 grids from ph_2010

Postby mith » Wed Jun 23, 2021 10:15 pm

1to9only wrote:The 11.8 and 11.9 grids are from ph_2010, in the (hidden) lists below, they appear in ER/EP/ED rating order. Within each grid, the number of nodes are in sorted order (i.e. they may NOT appear in the same order in the solution path). Each grid solution path takes about 8-9 minutes of SE run!!


This is very cool, thanks for doing this!
mith
 
Posts: 996
Joined: 14 July 2020

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby mith » Wed Jun 23, 2021 11:46 pm

There weren't any 34c in the database, so I went ahead and rated the three I've generated. The high is a 10.4:

Code: Select all
34c
.............12.34..1.3..25..672.5...17..6...52..81.67.75.68...18.2....66.217..5.  ED=10.4/1.2/1.2


Also have a 10.3 diamond:

Code: Select all
...........1..2..3..2.3..14...25...6.276.8.3.5.6.73..8.785.63..2.538..676...27...  ED=10.3/10.3/10.3


And a new high for 33c:

Code: Select all
33c
..............1.23..2.34....25...67.6...752.88.7....35.53..68..28..5.36.7.6..8.52  ED=11.0/1.2/1.2
mith
 
Posts: 996
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby mith » Fri Jun 25, 2021 8:40 pm

More highs:

Code: Select all
32c
...........1..2..3.3..4..56.17.8....2.87.34..34.21...8.74.38...1.342....8..1.7..4  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
.............12.34..5..36...37...84.6.4..8..785....3.6.7....46.4.38..7.556...7.83  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
..............1..2..3..4.56.1..73..553.41..7.7.48.5....415...8.3.71.8...85..47..3  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
..............1..2..3..4.56.1..73...53.41..7.7.48.5....415...8.3.71.85..85..47..3  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
..............1..2..3..4.56.1..73..553.4...7.7.48.5..1.415...8.3.71.8...85..47..3  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
..............1..2..3..4.56..7.18....4135..8.85.4.7..3.1.7.3..553.14..7.7.4.85...  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
..............1..2..3..4.56.1..73...53.4...7.7.48.5..1.415...8.3.71.85..85..47..3  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
..............1..2.34...56.....578.6..62.8.7..87.1..25....762.8.7.12..5.6..8.5.17  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
..............1..2..3..4.56.14.6..783.74.8...86..17..3.4..73...63.14...77.18.6...  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
..............1..2..3..4.56..7.48....1463..7886.1.7..3.4.7.3...63.41...77.1.86...  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
..............1..2..3.4..15..6.74....841.3.7.17.86...3.3841....6.1.378..74.6...3.  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
........1.....2.....3..456..31..7.56.8..6.7.37.65..81..58..6..73.7....8.61..78.3.  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
........1.....2.3..45...2......21.63..3.7.8.26..8.371.....67..8...2.817..8731..26  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
..............1.23.12....45.46.17....7.8.6...8.12....6.68.724..1..6.4...42.18..67  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
..............1.23.12....45.46.17....7.8.6..48.12....6.68.72...1..6.4...42.18..67  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2

33c
...........1..2..3..2.4..56.17.84....5.21...82.85.7..4.75.284..12...5.8.8.41....5  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
...........1..2..3..2.4..56.17.845...5.21...82.85.7..4.75.284..12...5.8.8.41.....  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2

34c
..............1.23.12.3..45..6.17...73.8.62..8.132..76.63.72...17.6.....2.81.3..7  ED=10.7/1.2/1.2
mith
 
Posts: 996
Joined: 14 July 2020

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby mith » Sat Jun 26, 2021 1:25 am

One more:

Code: Select all
31c
........1.....2.34....5.62...276.....78..9...69..28..5.67.85...82.9.6.5.9.527....  ED=11.2/1.2/1.2
mith
 
Posts: 996
Joined: 14 July 2020

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby mith » Wed Jun 30, 2021 12:52 pm

Code: Select all
31c
........1.....2.3...1.4..5..16.78...2.74...8684.2.61...6.78..14.8.6.472.7........  ED=11.3/1.2/1.2
mith
 
Posts: 996
Joined: 14 July 2020

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby mith » Fri Jul 02, 2021 3:18 pm

Code: Select all
35c
..............1234..2.53..6.23..746.74....8.28.6....7..7..3.6.826..7834.3.8.4..27  ED=10.6/1.2/1.2
mith
 
Posts: 996
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby mith » Fri Jul 02, 2021 3:48 pm

Code: Select all
34c
..............1.23..2.34.56.2314..787.4.8....81.7.2....8.4.7.3.24.31..8.3.7.28...  ED=11.0/1.2/1.2
mith
 
Posts: 996
Joined: 14 July 2020

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby mith » Sat Jul 03, 2021 3:33 am

Code: Select all
32c
........1....1234..13..5.....1.6..376.7..14.883.4..6....6....84.7..861..38....76.  ED=11.2/1.2/1.2
........1.....234..13..5.....1.6..376.7..14.883.4..6...7..86..3.8.1..76.1.6....84  ED=11.2/1.2/1.2
........1.....234..13..5.....1.6..376.7..14.883.4..6...7..86...1.6....8438.1..76.  ED=11.2/1.2/1.2
........1.....2.3.....4.5...2346.7.86.7..83..84..37....8267....4.6.23...73.8.4.2.  ED=11.2/1.2/1.2
mith
 
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby mith » Sun Jul 04, 2021 11:56 pm

First 11.8 on the new computer.

Code: Select all
22c
........1.....234..34....2.......1.5.....3.6....15...7.68..4...7...9....9..5....3  ED=11.8/11.8/2.6
mith
 
Posts: 996
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby mith » Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:19 am

Code: Select all
34c
...........1..2..3..4.3..56.....7.38..285.6.7.786.352....38.76..8.2..3.56...75.82  ED=11.1/1.2/1.2
mith
 
Posts: 996
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Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby denis_berthier » Mon Jul 05, 2021 6:53 am

mith wrote:First 11.8 on the new computer.
Code: Select all
22c
........1.....234..34....2.......1.5.....3.6....15...7.68..4...7...9....9..5....3  ED=11.8/11.8/2.6


in B5B (or lower).
denis_berthier
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