The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Everything about Sudoku that doesn't fit in one of the other sections

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby coloin » Thu Nov 08, 2012 2:38 pm

dobrichev wrote:........1.....2.3....14.5....3.....6.5.7..4..8.......2..6..8..5.4.51.....9..7.1.. skfr=11.8/11.8/2.6

extending dorichev's search
here are a few more from the pattern below [ED using skfr]
Code: Select all
98.7.....6..89......5..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......1.4.........2;11.80;11.80;2.60;GP;H3;26;22

new
98.7.....6..89......1..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.8/11.8/2.6
68.7.....3..89......5..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......1.4.........2 ED=11.8/1.5/1.5 
68.7.....3..89......1..4...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.8/1.5/1.5 

in database already
98.7.....6..89......4..5...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......1.4.........2 ED=11.5/11.5/2.6
98.7.....6..89......4..1...7...3.9....6...7....2....51.6..8.3.......5.4.........2 ED=11.3/11.3/2.6
68.7.....9..86......5..4...7...3.9....6...3....2....51.6..8.7.......1.4.........2 ED=11.2/11.2/2.6

quite a pattern
C
coloin
 
Posts: 1637
Joined: 05 May 2005

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Fri Nov 09, 2012 2:52 pm

the four new have a serate rating equal to skfr (I still try to get the serate rating over 11.5)
They will be in the next update of the potential hardest now located here
champagne
2017 Supporter
 
Posts: 5680
Joined: 02 August 2007
Location: France Brittany

distribution by pattern

Postby dobrichev » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:58 pm

The distribution by pattern of puzzles rated 10+
Hidden Text: Show
Code: Select all
#patterns  #puzzles in pattern
      1    1430
      1    1300
      1    1229
      1    1227
      1    1225
      1    1169
      1    1146
      1     992
      1     943
      1     934
      1     862
      1     812
      1     786
      1     780
      1     750
      1     722
      2     694
      1     678
      1     656
      1     644
      1     635
      1     624
      1     603
      1     570
      2     569
      1     478
      1     466
      1     456
      1     447
      1     422
      1     415
      1     410
      1     405
      1     397
      1     376
      1     374
      1     364
      1     360
      1     354
      1     350
      2     349
      1     342
      1     323
      1     321
      1     316
      1     311
      1     306
      2     304
      1     302
      1     301
      2     299
      1     292
      1     283
      1     282
      1     281
      1     278
      1     277
      1     274
      1     271
      1     270
      1     267
      1     263
      1     259
      1     258
      2     252
      3     251
      2     243
      2     237
      2     236
      1     235
      1     234
      2     233
      2     230
      1     227
      1     226
      1     225
      1     222
      2     221
      1     220
      1     219
      2     218
      2     217
      2     214
      1     209
      2     206
      2     205
      1     204
      1     202
      1     201
      2     200
      1     199
      1     198
      1     197
      1     196
      1     195
      1     194
      3     193
      1     192
      1     191
      1     189
      1     185
      4     184
      1     183
      2     182
      2     180
      1     179
      1     178
      1     177
      1     176
      3     175
      3     174
      1     173
      1     172
      2     171
      2     170
      2     169
      1     168
      1     167
      2     163
      3     162
      2     160
      1     159
      1     158
      3     157
      4     156
      1     155
      3     154
      6     153
      2     151
      4     150
      4     149
      1     148
      4     147
      4     146
      1     145
      1     144
      3     143
      5     142
      2     141
      4     140
      3     139
      2     138
      2     137
      3     136
      1     135
      7     134
      4     133
      1     132
      7     131
      4     130
      4     129
      3     128
      4     127
      3     126
      5     125
     11     124
      4     123
      5     122
      7     121
      4     120
      8     119
      6     118
      5     117
      6     116
     10     115
      7     114
     10     113
      2     112
      7     111
      7     110
      7     109
      8     108
      8     107
     10     106
      6     105
      9     104
      9     103
     10     102
     15     101
     12     100
     11      99
     10      98
     10      97
     10      96
      9      95
      9      94
     13      93
     15      92
     12      91
      8      90
     18      89
     11      88
     15      87
     13      86
     19      85
     17      84
     15      83
     13      82
     17      81
     12      80
     18      79
     20      78
     21      77
     24      76
     22      75
     22      74
     22      73
     20      72
     33      71
     27      70
     22      69
     17      68
     29      67
     22      66
     27      65
     34      64
     32      63
     31      62
     52      61
     35      60
     48      59
     44      58
     52      57
     50      56
     40      55
     42      54
     47      53
     50      52
     64      51
     53      50
     74      49
     69      48
     79      47
     74      46
     91      45
     96      44
    102      43
     97      42
     98      41
    105      40
    114      39
    139      38
    168      37
    136      36
    186      35
    197      34
    206      33
    228      32
    230      31
    254      30
    281      29
    307      28
    313      27
    416      26
    450      25
    495      24
    527      23
    628      22
    708      21
    767      20
    886      19
   1031      18
   1206      17
   1439      16
   1580      15
   2041      14
   2249      13
   3040      12
   3520      11
   4859      10
   5892       9
   8431       8
  10804       7
  16720       6
  23840       5
  45632       4
  78974       3
 229067       2
1003664       1
dobrichev
2016 Supporter
 
Posts: 1316
Joined: 24 May 2010

distribution by rating

Postby dobrichev » Wed Nov 14, 2012 11:19 pm

Number of puzzles per skfr rating
Code: Select all
      1 11.9
     36 11.8
     34 11.7
     88 11.6
    124 11.5
    210 11.4
   1851 11.3
   8350 11.2
  19010 11.1
  22241 11.0
  29640 10.9
  18842 10.8
  23765 10.7
 119338 10.6
 177626 10.5
 674990 10.4
 654807 10.3
 781068 10.2
 310700 10.1
 132792 10.0
dobrichev
2016 Supporter
 
Posts: 1316
Joined: 24 May 2010

Re: distribution by pattern

Postby champagne » Wed Nov 28, 2012 12:55 pm

dobrichev wrote:The distribution by pattern of puzzles rated 10+


Hi mladen,

One question regarding that list.

Is that strictly a count per pattern or a count per any morph of a given pattern.

I have statistics tending to tell that the answer is the first option.

BTW, I got my first puzzle of 25 clues rating 11.6.

The first step which is to diversify the seeds is very very long, I hope now to get better puzzles, starting from the seeds found.
champagne
2017 Supporter
 
Posts: 5680
Joined: 02 August 2007
Location: France Brittany

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby dobrichev » Wed Nov 28, 2012 6:55 pm

Hi champagne,

Every 10+ puzzle that can be morphed to fit in a given pattern is assigned to this pattern and is counted once. Any of the patterns is counted once.
If you sum vertically the first column, you find the total number of the patterns.
If you multiply the two columns in a row and then sum, you find the total number of puzzles.

Why you think the counts are unrealistic?

I have 4 25-clue 11.6-s. 26-s and 27-s are up to 11.1, but as you know I focused my search to lower number of clues.
dobrichev
2016 Supporter
 
Posts: 1316
Joined: 24 May 2010

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Wed Nov 28, 2012 7:42 pm

dobrichev wrote:Why you think the counts are unrealistic?


I am working on the canonical form of the pattern and i have "patterns" with much more than 1430 puzzles using the file of seed (about 7 million puzzles).
One of us (if not both) have a problem.
This has to be investigated. I'll look to morrow for a detailed list for one example;

dobrichev wrote:
I have 4 25-clue 11.6-s. 26-s and 27-s are up to 11.1, but as you know I focused my search to lower number of clues.


I have many more below 11.6,(about 4000 with a skfr rating 10.9 and more) but as you say, we are searching in different areas.
champagne
2017 Supporter
 
Posts: 5680
Joined: 02 August 2007
Location: France Brittany

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby dobrichev » Wed Nov 28, 2012 10:06 pm

champagne wrote:i have "patterns" with much more than 1430 puzzles using the file of seed (about 7 million puzzles)

Are these puzzles ever rated or they only have some kind of "potential"?
dobrichev
2016 Supporter
 
Posts: 1316
Joined: 24 May 2010

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:10 am

dobrichev wrote:Are these puzzles ever rated or they only have some kind of "potential"?


The file available for download in the skfr project has no rating, but nearly all these puzzles have been rated once wit a skfr cut off 10.0 or 10.2.
I noticed that you made statistics on about 3 millions puzzles, the download is more than double;
I'll send you more details through a mail.
champagne
2017 Supporter
 
Posts: 5680
Joined: 02 August 2007
Location: France Brittany

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Wed Dec 05, 2012 2:55 pm

dobritchev made a lot of work in the search of potential hardest.
We have now a much bigger file and new high serate ratings including a 11.9 an several 11.8.

This was worth an update of the file that replaces the old one.
It can be downloaded from the downloads in skfr project
champagne
2017 Supporter
 
Posts: 5680
Joined: 02 August 2007
Location: France Brittany

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby dobrichev » Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:00 pm

Thanks for the update.

At the bottom of the list some non-diamond 10.3 appeared.
dobrichev
2016 Supporter
 
Posts: 1316
Joined: 24 May 2010

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby coloin » Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:30 pm

here are the new puzzles with skfr that i found above 11.3 [79 11.0 and above]
Code: Select all
....5.7.....9.1.6.........52....8.16.......2..3....4.7.7..4......82.9...9.68..... ED=11.4/11.4/9.2
.2...1......6...3...9.8...7..5....78.3.....1.8...4.5....4.9.7...6.2.....9.......5 ED=11.5/11.5/9.7
2.......6.3..8..1...4...9...5.3.1......82.......7.5.8...9...2...7..1..5.6.......4 ED=11.6/11.6/11.3
98.7.....7..8..9....5.4....39....6...6.........2....31...3..76.....1...2.....5..4 ED=11.6/11.6/2.6
..1.5.7..4....9....8.2.....2......4..9.8.......3.6.5.....5.16......7..13..6.....7 ED=11.7/1.2/1.2 

C
coloin
 
Posts: 1637
Joined: 05 May 2005

Re: The hardest sudokus (new thread)

Postby champagne » Thu Dec 06, 2012 8:36 am

dobrichev wrote:Thanks for the update.

At the bottom of the list some non-diamond 10.3 appeared.


A small problem with my selection. I'll revise the criteria for the future.

Are also missing the last lot with clues over 25.

I'll add these puzzles and I'll also check the last coloin list. (for the next update, no immediate effect)

The next update, as soon as possible, will be a new release of the exotic properties and likely my new short list of hardest.
champagne
2017 Supporter
 
Posts: 5680
Joined: 02 August 2007
Location: France Brittany

the latest collection

Postby dobrichev » Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:38 am

Hi champagne,

Could you reconsider the following puzzles from your latest list?
Hidden Text: Show
Code: Select all
98.76....76....9.......5...5......94..3.987.....2...1.4......21...3.........475.. ED=8.3/1.2/1.2
98.76......5...4...........73.....9...62.37.....8.7..432...8......9..3......5...1 ED=8.5/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..75.....9.....6....8....43...3......2..1.9..8...2...4.....68..5......3..1 ED=7.1/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..75.....9.....4....8..6...4...3...2.1.....5....6...2.....189..7.......5.3 ED=7.2/1.5/1.5
98.7..6..75.....8.....6....4..87..5..3...42..........3.74.....1...65..9......2... ED=7.1/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..75.....8.....6....4....35...3.........259..6.1....2.7....98..5.......4.1 ED=7.7/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..5...4..3......9..2.68...1...2.1.......1.8...9..76..2......3..5......4... ED=8.3/1.2/1.2
98.7..6....5..........96....74.3..2....4.8..........17.6.....9...86..3......53..1 ED=6.7/1.2/1.2
98.7..6......95..........746..3...9..2....1......683..1..93.....5.........8..4..2 ED=4.5/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..75..8.........6...4..3...2.....759..........1.732.......1.698.........4. ED=7.2/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..5..4.........86.5.7......83..6.....4....21....9........35....1...2.158.. ED=6.6/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..75.....8.....6....5..4.3.7..4....8....389..5...2.....4...95..6......1... ED=7.2/1.2/1.2
987.........96.54......3...6..52.....7......5..5..41.2.3.........821...9.....86.. ED=2.3/1.5/1.5
98.76.5..7.58..9.........6.8..5..4...32..............15...84..9..7...8.....9....5 ED=6.6/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..75..9.........6...5..4...3..2.........1.897....4....21...3.........658.. ED=2.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..75..4.........3.9.8.......3.3..2.7......17.....7....58..647.1.....2..... ED=2.6/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..75.....9.....6....46...3......95..6......25...14...2.....87..5.........1 ED=2.6/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..7..65.4.......8...6......9..749......5...67..5..4..9....3.2...1....7.... ED=7.1/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..7......8.....65...43...9......57..9.........21.3...2.....98..6......4..1 ED=3.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..7......5.....43.7.2.....7.4.7.9.......5..189..5.6...8...6.....3....2.... ED=7.1/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..5.4..........6..53.76..32....86.........1..7...28..3.......1..4.......9. ED=2.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..5..4.........83.9.7.....2...3..7..8......5..13.6.9..5....2..1.......7..4 ED=9.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..5...9..4......3..2.713.......8.6.1.......4.....31..8......5..2.........4 ED=4.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..5...9..4......3..2.6....1...231.......1.74.....86..3......4..2.........5 ED=3.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6.....65..9........8487.........3.2.........5..172.....6...4.917........2.3 ED=4.5/1.2/1.2
98.7..6......95.4.........38.5.......9..2..17...1.8...25.9..4......3.........7.6. ED=3.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6......9.........5.4..6......9.34...2....28....7..6..4.5....2..7.3....1.... ED=7.1/1.2/1.2
98.76....7.....85.......46..7..8..43..3.........2.9..1.5..4.6....29..........1... ED=7.1/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..5...43..........427.6...5.....5...29....1.....372..4......5..17.....8... ED=7.2/1.2/1.2
98.7..6......9..5.....43..28.46......7...1....6.....232..47......8.....5......21. ED=8.3/1.2/1.2
98.7.......7...65.....96...7.5..8......4...32......1..6.8..9....3..........12.4.. ED=4.5/1.2/1.2
98.76....5....94.........3.7.9...5...5.2.4..8...5....62..9..1....1.3..7......2... ED=7.2/1.5/1.5
98.76......5...94......3...4..93...5..8...72......6...2..4.7.9..71............8.2 ED=6.6/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..7......5.....4.....739...8...4..2.......1.9.3..2.....1...5.........34.6. ED=2.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..5...4.........3.9.4...3.....5.8....2.....9.5..761.......2..58.1......7.. ED=4.0/1.2/1.2
98.7.....6...5.8.......4.3.3...6..4..4......9..2..91....7.8.5.....6..........1.92 ED=6.6/1.2/1.2
98.7.....6...5.4.........93.73....6...2...5.....3.7..8..81.2.......4.3.1.......5. ED=7.1/1.2/1.2
9876.....65.94.........53..76.2.......1..........5..4.2.........9...28.7...8..6.9 ED=1.5/1.2/1.2
98.76....7.....95......4...6..5..3...7..3...6..2.....41...5.6....81...92...6..... ED=2.0/1.2/1.2
98.76......5..49.........3.3..2...8..7......4......2.52..9..8....34.1.9.........6 ED=2.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..76..8.........5...4......73...2.........968...315....4....795.........1. ED=2.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..7...6..9.....5......759.4.......3.2.........1..648.5....1....36.....2... ED=2.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6..5..69...........4.67.3....8..3...2.......97..36.8.......2..18......5...6 ED=1.5/1.2/1.2
98.7..6....7....9...54...3.72....9....3.7..5.........42...89....1...........621.. ED=2.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6....7..........543..8.2.7.....7.....94...8....142.1.......5..........93.6. ED=2.0/1.2/1.2
98.7..6.....95..4......3..874......6..2.149.........5.27.........4.3.......6..21. ED=1.5/1.2/1.2
dobrichev
2016 Supporter
 
Posts: 1316
Joined: 24 May 2010

Re: the latest collection

Postby champagne » Thu Dec 06, 2012 10:22 am

dobrichev wrote:Hi champagne,

Could you reconsider the following puzzles from your latest list?


Clearly some room for errors in the process (I have one idea that I'll test for these)

I'll cancel these ones, but this also means that other puzzles could have a wrong rating.

Anyway, as some bugs have been fixed in skfr, I'll re rate the entire file of skfr ratings and clean the file if other problems appear

thanks
champagne
2017 Supporter
 
Posts: 5680
Joined: 02 August 2007
Location: France Brittany

PreviousNext

Return to General

cron