Dollar Sudoku and Tape Sudoku

For fans of Killer Sudoku, Samurai Sudoku and other variants

Postby Ruud » Tue Oct 03, 2006 5:17 am


You may be confusing a few issues here, and so does your Hungarian source.

Copyright does not protect a puzzle format. It can only protect an individual puzzle. More specific: the puzzle image and text components.

There have been attempts to protect Sudoku puzzles, but every Sudoku can also be represented by an 81 digit number. Not a likely object to receive any legal protection. A simple scramble can also create an equivalent that falls outside the copyright protection.

Theoretically, a puzzle format could be protected by a patent, but these are rarely granted for ideas without physical shape and volume. Software, for instance, cannot be patented. We would all be reading this forum with the same browser if that were the case.

Pappocom did not invent the Sudoku format and does claim copyright for the puzzles he creates. Nobody has challenged that. Uwe does the same with sudoku variants, yet you choose to attack him.
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Postby Pyrrhon » Tue Oct 03, 2006 10:52 am

There was a dispute with personal insults of Henry Kwok about the question whether I can make puzzle of the formats published at the page of Age of Puzzles and whether I can use the names. Henry Kwok has made some puzzles where some information is betwen the cells (natural numbers, fractions, <, >, //, \\). This graphical design isn't new because we have many other puzzle variants with at least natural numbers and <, > signs between the cells.

I guess he had contacted the owners of other pages I link on my side. One of them is the very interesting variant page of hexapuzzles (the rules of there puzzle formats you can find here).

About the fact that variants and there names cannot be copyrighted something was written above. What the evidences at the Hungarian page show is that a book cover and a book are copyrighted. These things are out of question. But a book cover can be also be copyrighted if it shows a killer sudoku or a classic sudoku, or sudoku x ... And the same with a book. That doesn't mean that also these variants are copyrighted . Elsewhere only one publisher would publish sudoku books.

But this are arguments and quixote doesn't like to argue. At least up today he hasn't answered to any of the arguments.

By the way: On both pages are variants which aren't really new. Gabor Tamas and Henry Kwok could also dispute who is the inventor of Difference Sudoku (Hungarian name) and Pole Star Sudoku (Kwok's name). But this would be a historical dispute and not a copyright issue. I guess the result would be, both aren't.

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Postby quixote » Tue Oct 03, 2006 4:50 pm

Wiedemann has claimed that his Lesniewski-Page has been linked to the PPP site "since a long time". I have learned that he informed PPP about the link only after the disclaimer appeared in this forum. So it looks like he has totally lost the sense of time.

To him, "since a long time" means only two days ago. If he really wants to credit the sources of whatever he has translated or copied, why has he have to wait for seven years to do so? If not for the reminder, he will never care to respond to the disclaimer.

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Postby Pyrrhon » Tue Oct 03, 2006 5:29 pm

The link is on my page at least since February 2006. I have no exact date. Call it a long time or not. I have changed it not knowing the accusation as I've actualized some of my pages. The disclaimer and the allegation in it was unknown to me up to the day you wrote about it. Don't ask for the letter in 1999, I'm not aware of it. Immediately after I read about the problem I contacted the colleagues there to hear what can I do to solve the problem. I think this is normal. They said me that they will delete this part of the disclaimer because there is no actual problem.

But all that has nothing to do with the copyrights of puzzles. You miss the subject.

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Postby quixote » Tue Oct 03, 2006 5:51 pm

Don't you have the sense of courtesy of a First World citizen to ask the owners for permission before you take anything, and credit the sources of everything taken without the owners asking for it? If you failed to do so seven years ago, why wait until February 2006? That makes a good and interesting puzzle.

Julius Caesar had said: "I come, I see, I conquer." But to you, the motto seems to be: "I come, I see, I take" as applied to the realm of cyber space.
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Postby Smythe Dakota » Wed Oct 04, 2006 1:18 am

Could the moderator put an end to this conversation, please?

Bill Smythe
Smythe Dakota
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