More Homework 7

Everything about Sudoku that doesn't fit in one of the other sections

Re: More Homework 7

Postby JPF » Fri Dec 09, 2022 1:36 pm

coloin wrote:No i think your pattern calculations are good - as Serg verified it !

A quick and approximate value:
There are C(9,2)=36 ways to fill a box with two clues.
Then, before taking into account any automorphism, there are (36^9)/(2x6^8) = 30,233,088 "ed"-patterns.
This number has to be increased by a factor equal to the average number of automorphisms in such patterns.
A first and very quick Monte Carlo estimation gives a factor of 1.1
therefore, the approximate value would be : 1.1 x 30,233,088 = 33,256,397 which is in accordance with my 33,135,278
number and approved by Serg! :)
That 33,135,278 number was calculated by using the conjugaison classes of the group of transformations acting on that set of patterns and Burnside's theorem.

Actually, I tried to use an other way to find that number, but I found a bug in a program I've been using for a while...

JPF
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Re: More Homework 7

Postby blue » Fri Dec 09, 2022 10:00 pm

coloin wrote:Have to confess I had prepared a big file of over 3M 222222222-18s several years ago.
Looking at several series of non-random random 18C , it appears that the incidence of these 22222222-18s is arounbd 1% of total 18C.
So maybe there are around 20M of these puzzles

Good estimates !

I have a large collection of 18's too.
9,879,195 of 1,263,079,675 of them (0.78%) have the 222222222 form.
They cover 1,662,444 ED patterns.

I ran something to estimate the total number of (9 x 2)'s.
The result was (14.44 +/- 0.48) million, with 95% confidence ... or ~0.75% all 18's.

This is my highest rated puzzle:

Code: Select all
+-------+-------+-------+
| . . 3 | . . . | . . . |
| . . 6 | 7 8 . | . . . |
| . . . | . . . | 5 4 . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| . 1 . | . . . | . . 7 |
| . 9 . | . . 1 | 2 . . |
| . . . | . . 4 | . . . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| . . . | . . . | 9 2 . |
| 8 . 7 | 6 . . | . . . |
| . . . | 3 . . | . . . |
+-------+-------+-------+   ED=9.4/2.6/2.6

(I have one 9.4, three 9.3's, and 32 9.2's ... but I'm missing ~1/3 of the 9 x 2's)
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Re: More Homework 7

Postby totuan » Sat Dec 10, 2022 1:13 pm

::: Off Topic :::
blue wrote:This is my highest rated puzzle:
Code: Select all
+-------+-------+-------+
| . . 3 | . . . | . . . |
| . . 6 | 7 8 . | . . . |
| . . . | . . . | 5 4 . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| . 1 . | . . . | . . 7 |
| . 9 . | . . 1 | 2 . . |
| . . . | . . 4 | . . . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| . . . | . . . | 9 2 . |
| 8 . 7 | 6 . . | . . . |
| . . . | 3 . . | . . . |
+-------+-------+-------+   ED=9.4/2.6/2.6

Code: Select all
 *-----------------------------------------------------------------------------*
 | 1259    258     3       | 12459   124569  2569    | 1678    16789   12689   |
 | 12459   245     6       | 7       8       2359    | 13      139     1239    |
 | 1279    278     1289    | 129     12369   2369    | 5       4       123689  |
 |-------------------------+-------------------------+-------------------------|
 | 23456   1       2458    | 2589    23569   235689  | 3468    35689   7       |
 | 34567   9       458     | 58      3567    1       | 2       3568    34568   |
 | 23567   235678  258     | 2589    235679  4       | 1368    135689  135689  |
 |-------------------------+-------------------------+-------------------------|
 | 13456   3456    145     | 1458    145     7       | 9       2       134568  |
 | 8       2345    7       | 6       12459   259     | 134     135     1345    |
 | 124569  2456    12459   | 3       1245    258     | 14678   15678   14568   |
 *-----------------------------------------------------------------------------*

For reference:
This is weird puzzle, one can solve by 3 AIC steps that start at elimination 8r9c6.

Thanks for the puzzle!
totuan
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Re: More Homework 7

Postby coloin » Wed Dec 14, 2022 1:27 pm

Great ... that saved a good bit of work - that 9.4 would have been a task to find ...
- the 18s that I tended to generate are the non-remote ones - and probably those are the ones that blue has too.

I had previously been generating some/nearly all of the 18C puzzles which have 2 diagonal clues per box and max 2 clues in a row/column ]. [these are large minlex].

Edit therefore.....

I found 254 ED puzzles which fitted this requirement [ 2 diagonal clues per box row and column] [ 2 were non-minimal]

Example
Code: Select all
+---+---+---+
|...|..1|..2|
|..3|...|.4.|
|.5.|.6.|...|
+---+---+---+
|...|..2|.1.|
|.4.|...|5..|
|6..|7..|...|
+---+---+---+
|...|.8.|6..|
|..1|5..|...|
|2..|...|..7|
+---+---+---+    ED=3.4/3.4/3.4

Here are the [18] 18C puzzles which have all 6 diagonal clues in each of the 6 bands different and hence I expect have the largest minlex
Code: Select all
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........2.1..4....5..6..7.........8.6....15.....2.......7  ED=3.4/3.4/3.4
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........2.1..7....5..6..8.........7.6....95.....2.......8
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........2.1..7....5..6..8.........7.8....25.....1.......6
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........2.3..4....7..6..5........3..5....2.8....1.......6
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........2.3..4....7..6..5........8..6....9.3....2.......5
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........2.3..6....7..8..4.........7.6....23.....1.......8
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........2.3..7....5..6..8.........3.6....24.....1.......7
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........2.3..7....5..6..8.........7.8....25.....1.......6
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........2.3..7....8..6..4.........8.6....23.....1.......9
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........2.3..7....8..6..4........3..5....2.7....1.......6  ED=7.9/7.1/3.4   [Perfect-18-1]
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........2.5..4....6..7..3........5..8....2.4....1.......7
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........2.7..8....5..6..9.........8.6....15.....2.......9
.....1..2..3....4..5..6.........3.5..7....6..1..8.........7.1....45.....2.......8
.....1..2..3....4..5..6........3.1....47.....2.......8...9...3..1....6..8....2...
.....1..2..3....4..5..6........3.1....47.....8.......9...8...3..1....6..2....9...
.....1..2..3....4..5..6........3.1....74.....2.......8...7...3..1....5..8....2...
.....1..2..3....4..5..6........3.1....74.....8.......5...7...3..1....6..2....8...
.....1..2..3....4..5..6........3.1....74.....8.......9...7...3..1....6..2....8...

There were 16 patterns which had valid puzzles and 2 patterns didnt appear to have any puzzles.
Code: Select all
Pattern                                                                                    Puzzles found by non-exhaustive search
01###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X..X..X....X..X..X.....[A]        3
02###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X..X..X.X.....X.....X..[B]        6
03###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.....X.X..X.....[C]        7
04###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X......X.[D]       10
05###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X......X.X...X.....X.X..X.....[E]       10
06###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....[F]       13
07###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X..X....X.....X..[G]        0
08###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X...X...X..X..X.........X...X.X.X.....X.....X..[H]        0
09###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X...X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X.......X[J]        7
10###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X...X...X..X..X........X....X.X....X..X...X....[K]        8
11###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X...XX.....X.....X......X.X...X......XX..X.....[L]       11
12###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X...XX.....X.....X......X.X...X.X.....X.......X[M]       44
13###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X...XX.....X.....X.....X....X.X....X..X...X....[N]        6
14###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X[P]       58
15###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X[Q]       25
16###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X.X.....X.....X.....X..X....X.....XX...X....[R]       11
17###.....X..X..X....X..X..X.........XX...X.X.....X......X.....X.X....XX.....X.......X[S]        8
18###.....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...[T]       27
                                                                                               254 Total

Only 3 of the patterns supported a 2 clue unavoidable set - the rest didnt
Code: Select all
.....2..1.1.....2...2.1.......2...1.2....1.....1...2......2.1...2.1.....1.......2###T
.....2..1.1.....2...2.1.......2..1....1.....22....1......1..2...2.....1.1...2....###A
.....1..2..1.2.....2....1...1.....2.2...1.......2....1..2....1.1....2......1..2..###S

Hidden Text: Show
.....1..2..1.3.....4.....5......63...7.....8.9..2.........4.1....6.....43..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X..X..X....X..X..X..... [A]
.....1..2..8.7.....4.....1......63...7.....8.2..9.........4.7....6.....41..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X..X..X....X..X..X.....
.....1..2..1.3.....4.....5......63...7.....8.2..9.........4.1....6.....43..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X..X..X....X..X..X..... # non-min
.....1..2..3....4..6..7.........8.6...93.....2.....7......4...1.4.6.....1.....2..### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X..X..X.X.....X.....X.. [B]
.....1..2..3....5..6..7.........8.6...93.....2.....7......5...1.5.6.....1.....9..### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X..X..X.X.....X.....X..
.....1..8..3....5..1..7.........8.6...94.....3.....7......3...9.7.5.....2.....1..### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X..X..X.X.....X.....X..
.....1..9..3....4..1..7.........8.6...95.....3.....7......3...5.7.4.....2.....1..### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X..X..X.X.....X.....X..
.....1..2..7....6..9..5.........5.1...32.....2.....7......3...7.4.6.....1.....5..### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X..X..X.X.....X.....X..
.....1..9..8....2..5..7.........8.6...92.....3.....5......3...1.8.5.....5.....3..### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X..X..X.X.....X.....X..
.....1..7..3.5.....6....8.......4.6..2....9..7..8.......4.9.......6...3.8.......4### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.....X.X..X..... [C]
.....1..7..2.3.....6....8.......4.2..3....9..7..8.......4.2.......6...3.8.......4### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....2..8..3.4.....6....9.......7.3..4....5..7..8.......8.9.......6...4.2.......7### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....2..8..3.5.....6....1.......7.3..9....5..7..8.......8.1.......9...5.2.......7### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....2..8..6.5.....5....9.......7.6..9....5..7..8.......8.9.......3...4.2.......7### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....8..2..3.5.....7....4.......9.4..8....5..2..4.......4.1.......7...9.9.......8### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....8..2..7.3.....5....4.......9.3..8....5..2..8.......4.1.......7...5.9.......8### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....7..5..1.5.....2....6.......4.3..8....1..7..6.......69.........8..7.5.......4### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X......X. [D]
.....7..5..1.5.....3....4.......4.1..8....6..7..2.......23.........8..7.5.......4### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X......X.
.....7..2..1.6.....3....9.......1.6..6....5..4..2.......59.........5..3.7.......6### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X......X.
.....7..5..1.5.....2....4.......4.1..9....8..7..2.......69.........8..7.5.......4### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X......X.
.....7..5..3.5.....2....6.......6.3..8....1..7..4.......62.........1..7.5.......4### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X......X.
.....7..4..1.5.....3....7.......9.1..8....3..4..1.......93.........8..2.7.......9### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X......X.
.....1..2..3.5.....9....1.......4.3..6....9..2..3.......49.........8..7.1.......4### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X......X.
.....4..2..8.9.....3....4.......7.1..9....3..4..2.......63.........8..5.7.......4### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X......X.
.....4..2..1.8.....3....4.......7.9..8....3..4..2.......53.........1..5.7.......4### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X......X.
.....1..2..1.3.....4.....5......6..5.3.4.....7.....1......8..4...7...3..2..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X......X.
.....7..2..1.6.....2.....4......5..6.8.4.....7.....2......9.1....5....8.6..2.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X......X.X...X.....X.X..X..... [E]
.....7..2..1.6.....3.....4......5..6.1.9.....4.....2......9.1....5....8.6..2.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X......X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....7..2..1.6.....3.....4......5..6.1.9.....7.....2......9.1....5....8.6..2.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X......X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....7..2..1.6.....3.....4......5..6.4.3.....7.....2......9.1....5....3.6..2.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X......X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....7..2..1.6.....3.....4......5..6.8.4.....7.....2......9.1....5....8.6..2.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X......X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....7..2..1.6.....8.....4.....5...67..4......1....2.......41....5....3.6..2.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X......X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....7..2..1.6.....8.....4.....5...68..4......1....2.......41....5....3.6..2.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X......X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....7..2..1.3.....9.....6......1..6.2.4.....7.....3......9.1....5....4.6..2.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X......X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....3..2..8.1.....9.....7......5..6.7.8.....2.....3......4.7....5....8.6..2.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X......X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
....2...1..8..3....3.....6......8..5.6....9..1..4.........6.3....5....1.2..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X......X.X...X.....X.X..X.....
.....1..2..1.2.....4.....5......5..3..4...8..2..7.........4.1...3.6.....5......7.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X.... [F]
.....1..2..9.3.....4.....5......9..1..4...3..2..5.........4.9...8.6.....5......7.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....
.....7..2..1.3.....6.....5......5..8..4...3..2..7.........4.1...3.6.....5......7.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....
.....7..2..1.3.....6.....5......5..8..4...3..2..7.........9.1...8.6.....5......7.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....
.....8..2..8.3.....4.....5......5..6..4...3..2..7.........4.8...1.6.....5......7.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....
.....1..2..1.8.....4.....3......5..3..4...8..5..7.........4.1...3.6.....2......5.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....
.....1..5..1.9.....6.....7......5..6..4...3..1..7.........4.1...8.2.....5......9.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....
.....2..6..1.3.....4.....5......5..3..3...4..2..7.........4.1...5.9.....6......7.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....
.....4..5..1.2.....4.....8......5..6..3...4..2..7.........4.1...8.6.....5......7.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....
.....7..2..8.3.....4.....5......2..6..7...8..2..5.........4.3...8.1.....5......7.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....
.....1..2..1....3..4..5.........2..6.7....1..5..8.........1.4....36.....2......9.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....
.....4..5..1.2.....4.....8......5..6..3...4..7..1.........4.3...8.6.....5......9.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....
.....1..8..7.3.....4.....5......7..6..1...3..4..5.........2.1...8.4.....5......7.### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X..X..XX.....X.....X.....X...X..X....X..X...X....
.....2..3..9.3.....7.....9......81...5......23..7........4...7...6...8..2...5....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X...X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X.......X [J]
.....2..5..1.3.....4.....8......61...5......33..7........1...4...6...8..2...5....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X...X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X.......X
.....2..3..9.3.....7.....8......84...5......23..6........4...1...6...8..2...5....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X...X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X.......X
.....1..2..1.3.....4.....5......61...5......33..7........4...7...6...8..2...5....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X...X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X.......X
.....2..5..1.3.....7.....4......69...5......33..7........4...7...6...8..2...5....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X...X...X..X..X.........X.X...X.X.....X.......X
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.....1..2..9.3.....6.....5......62...4.5.....3.......4...8...6...3...1..2...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..4..7.3.....2.....5......43...7.5.....8.......9...8...7...3...5..1...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..7..6.9.....8.....5......63...7.5.....9.......4...8...6...3...1..4...7....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..8..5.4.....4.....7......65...7.5.....9.......4...7...6...6...1..3...9....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..8..6.3.....4.....5......69...7.4.....2.......3...5...7...3...4..8...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....6..2..1.3.....5.....7......13...7.5.....2.......4...7...8...6...1..3...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....7..2..1.3.....5.....7......63...7.5.....2.......4...2...5...8...1..3...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....8..2..1.3.....4.....5......13...7.4.....5.......8...2...6...8...1..2...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....8..2..1.3.....4.....7......13...7.4.....5.......8...9...6...8...1..2...7....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....8..2..1.3.....7.....5......63...2.1.....5.......4...2...7...6...1..3...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....8..7..1.3.....6.....5......78...7.5.....9.......4...7...6...3...1..8...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....9..2..1.3.....4.....5......61...7.4.....8.......3...1...7...3...9..2...7....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....9..8..1.3.....4.....5......63...8.1.....4.......7...5...9...6...1..3...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..8..5.4.....6.....7......65...9.7.....8.......4...6...9...4...1..3...9....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....9..8..7.4.....6.....7......15...9.7.....8.......4...6...9...1...6..3...5....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..6..6.3.....4.....5......62...7.5.....5.......3...8...7...3...4..1...7....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..7..9.3.....6.....4......39...7.5.....1.......4...2...6...3...1..7...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..8..2.3.....6.....7......62...8.5.....1.......7...4...6...3...1..8...7....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..8..5.3.....9.....5......63...7.1.....5.......4...5...7...4...2..3...8....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....3..1..5.8.....6.....5......63...7.5.....2.......4...7...6...1...8..3...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....3..2..7.9.....5.....6......62...4.5.....3.......4...7...5...3...1..2...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....4..5..1.3.....7.....8......67...6.5.....3.......4...8...6...4...1..5...2....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....7..6..1.3.....4.....8......13...6.4.....5.......8...8...2...7...1..3...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....7..8..5.3.....6.....5......63...7.9.....5.......4...5...7...4...1..3...8....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....9..2..1.3.....8.....5......64...5.8.....2.......3...1...6...3...1..9...2....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..8..2.3.....8.....9......83...7.2.....5.......4...5...7...3...8..9...4....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X.........X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..2..1.3.....4.....5......63...7.5.....5.......4....4..7...3...1..2..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X [Q]
.....1..2..5.3.....4.....5......61...7.4.....2.......3....7..4...6...8..1..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..7.8.....4.....5......62...7.5.....5.......3....4..7...9...8..2..3.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....8..2..5.1.....6.....5......61...7.4.....5.......3....3..7...1...8..2..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..1.3.....4.....8......63...7.5.....1.......4....4..5...6...1..3..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..7.3.....8.....5......23...7.5.....5.......1....4..7...3...6..2..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..8..7.3.....2.....5......63...7.5.....8.......4....4..7...3...5..2..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..5.3.....4.....5......61...7.4.....2.......3....7..4...3...6..8..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..5.3.....4.....5......61...7.4.....2.......8....7..4...8...6..1..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..8.3.....4.....5......61...7.8.....2.......3....2..7...6...8..1..4.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..7..8.3.....4.....2......61...7.2.....2.......5....7..4...6...8..1..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..8.2.....4.....5......62...7.5.....1.......3....1..7...6...8..2..3.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....8..2..5.1.....6.....5......29...7.4.....5.......3....3..6...8...7..2..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..7.3.....5.....8......63...2.8.....1.......4....4..5...6...1..3..2.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..7.3.....8.....5......63...7.5.....2.......4....4..7...3...5..1..2.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..7.3.....8.....5......63...7.5.....8.......4....4..7...3...5..4..2.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..8.3.....4.....5......31...2.5.....6.......4....2..7...6...8..1..4.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..8.3.....4.....5......61...2.5.....3.......4....2..7...3...8..1..4.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..8.3.....4.....5......61...3.8.....2.......4....2..3...6...8..1..7.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..8.6.....4.....5......61...2.5.....3.......4....2..7...6...8..1..4.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....8..2..1.2.....4.....5......72...5.4.....1.......3....1..7...6...8..2..3.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....1..2..7.3.....5.....8......53...2.6.....1.......8....4..5...6...1..2..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....6..3..5.3.....4.....8......54...8.2.....1.......6....4..5...9...1..6..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....2..3..5.6.....4.....8......54...8.7.....1.......2....4..5...9...1..2..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X
.....3..2..3.8.....4.....5......13...7.4.....5.......8....4..7...5...6..2..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X....X..X..X........X..X....X.X....X.......X # non-min
.....1..2..1.3.....4.....5......63...7.5.....2......8.....4.1....6.....43..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X.X.....X.....X.....X..X....X.....XX...X.... [R]
.....8..2..1.3.....6.....5......13...4.2.....2......8.....8.7....6.....48..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X.X.....X.....X.....X..X....X.....XX...X....
.....8..2..1.3.....6.....5......13...4.2.....2......8.....8.7....9.....48..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X.X.....X.....X.....X..X....X.....XX...X....
.....8..2..1.3.....7.....5......61...4.2.....2......8.....8.7....6.....48..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X.X.....X.....X.....X..X....X.....XX...X....
.....1..2..1.3.....4.....5......63...1.7.....2......8.....4.1....6.....73..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X.X.....X.....X.....X..X....X.....XX...X....
.....1..2..1.3.....4.....5......63...5.2.....2......8.....7.1....6.....93..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X.X.....X.....X.....X..X....X.....XX...X....
.....1..2..1.3.....4.....5......63...7.4.....2......7.....8.1....6.....83..7.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X.X.....X.....X.....X..X....X.....XX...X....
.....2..3..1.3.....4.....8......63...7.5.....2......4.....4.1....6.....23..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X.X.....X.....X.....X..X....X.....XX...X....
.....2..5..1.3.....7.....9......63...1.5.....2......1.....7.1....6.....43..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X.X.....X.....X.....X..X....X.....XX...X....
.....8..2..1.3.....7.....5......93...4.2.....2......8.....8.7....6.....48..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X.X.....X.....X.....X..X....X.....XX...X....
.....8..2..9.3.....1.....5......93...4.2.....2......8.....8.1....6.....48..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........X.X..X.X.....X.....X.....X..X....X.....XX...X....
.....1..8..7.3.....4.....6....2..3...7...6...5.......4....4..7...3...6..2..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........XX...X.X.....X......X.....X.X....XX.....X.......X [S]
.....1..8..7.3.....4.....6....2..3...7...6...5.......4....4..7...3...6..9..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........XX...X.X.....X......X.....X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..8..7.3.....4.....6....2..3...7...6...5.......4....4..7...5...6..3..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........XX...X.X.....X......X.....X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..8..7.3.....5.....2....2..3...8...6...1.......4....1..7...5...6..3..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........XX...X.X.....X......X.....X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....5..3..2.7.....8.....6....5..2...7...6...1.......4....1..7...5...6..2..8.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........XX...X.X.....X......X.....X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....9..8..4.3.....8.....1....9..5...7...1...1.......3....4..7...5...6..9..5.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........XX...X.X.....X......X.....X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..3..7.9.....4.....6....4..3...2...6...5.......9....3..5...1...6..6..9.....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........XX...X.X.....X......X.....X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..2..1.3.....4.....5......26....74.....3......8....3....1.5....2..6...8....### .....X..X..X....X..X..X.........XX...X.X.....X......X.....X.X....XX.....X.......X
.....1..2..3....4..5..6........3.1....72.....8.......7...7...3..1....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X... [T]
.....1..2..3....4..5..6........3.1....74.....5.......8...7...3..1....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..2..3....4..5..6........3.1....74.....8.......5...7...3..1....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..2..3....4..5..6........3.1....74.....8.......9...7...3..1....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..2..3....4..9..6........3.1....64.....8.......5...7...3..5....6..1....5...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..2..3....7..5..8........3.8....74.....2.......5...2...3..1....6..5....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..2..3....8..4..6........2.1....74.....8.......5...7...4..3....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..2..3....8..5..6........3.1....24.....7.......8...7...3..4....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..2..3....9..5..6........3.1....94.....7.......8...7...3..1....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..2..6....7..5..6........3.1....74.....2.......4...7...3..3....6..4....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..2..7....4..5..6........3.1....34.....6.......5...7...3..1....7..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..2..7....4..5..6........3.1....34.....7.......9...7...3..1....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..7..6....4..5..6........3.1....84.....7.......9...7...6..1....5..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..7..3....4..5..6........3.1....75.....8.......2...2...3..1....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..7..8....4..3..6........9.1....74.....8.......5...7...3..1....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..8..3....4..4..6........3.1....24.....8.......5...7...2..1....6..5....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..8..3....4..4..6........3.1....92.....8.......5...7...3..1....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..8..3....4..5..6........3.1....49.....8.......2...7...3..1....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..8..3....4..5..6........3.1....74.....8.......2...7...3..1....5..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..8..3....4..5..6........5.1....46.....8.......2...7...3..1....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..8..3....4..5..6........5.1....76.....8.......2...7...3..1....5..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..8..4....7..5..3........4.1....56.....8.......2...7...3..1....5..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..8..6....4..5..6........3.1....75.....8.......2...7...3..1....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..8..6....7..5..6........3.1....74.....8.......2...7...3..3....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....9..2..3....4..6..1........3.1....54.....8.......5...7...3..1....6..4....5...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..2..3....4..1..6........3.1....24.....5.......8...7...5..3....6..6....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...
.....1..2..3....8..5..6........4.5....26.....1.......8...7...5..4....6..2....8...### .....X..X..X....X..X..X........X.X....XX.....X.......X...X...X..X....X..X....X...

You would have presumed that these 18C patterns came directly from the 18 [ was 15 but 3 more found !!] 27C patterns from Here.
But this was not the case - some 27C patterns couldnt make an 18C which fitted the 2 diagonal clues in each row column and box [ or at least I couldnt make one]
Some 27C had 2 18C patterns !!
Code: Select all
27C pattern                                                                                18C pattern
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X..## 01 ##  T18                                   
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X.X..X..X...X.## 02 ##  P18                                   
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X## 03 ##                 cant make 18C template
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X.X..X.X....XX...X.X..## 04 ##  Q18                                   
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X.X..X..X...X...X..X..X.X.X...X.X...X.X..## 05 ##  F18 and H18    no H18 puzzle         
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X.X..X..X...X...X..X.X..X.X....XX...X.X..## 06 ##  N18                                   
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X.X..X..X...X...X.X...X.X...X.X.X..X..X..## 07 ##  J18                                   
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X.X..X..X...X...X.X...X.X.X...X.X....XX..## 08 ##  C18 and D18                           
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X.X..X..X...X...X.X..X..X...XX..X..X....X## 09 ##  E18 and M18                           
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X.X..X..X...X...X.X..X..X.X....XX....XX..## 10 ##  L18                                   
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X.X...X.X.X...X.X....XX..## 11 ##                 cant make 18C template
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X.X...X.X.X..X..X....X.X.## 12 ##  B18 and R18                           
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X.X..X.X....XX...X.X....X.X...X.X...XX..X..X...X.## 13 ##                 cant make 18C template
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X.X..X.X....XX...X.X....X.X...X.X.X..X..X....X.X.## 14 ##  K18                                   
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X.X..X.X....XX...X.X....X.X.X...X.X...X.X....X..X## 15 ##  G18            no G18 puzzle           
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X##NEW1##  A18                                   
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X.X.X...X.X....XX....X.X.##NEW2##  S18                                   
..X..X..X.X..X..X.X..X..X....X.X.X...X.X....XX....X.X...XX...X..X...XX..X...X...X##NEW3##                 cant make 18C template
coloin
 
Posts: 2494
Joined: 05 May 2005
Location: Devon

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