Historical Daily 26

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Historical Daily 26

Postby Leren » Sun May 27, 2018 9:46 pm

Code: Select all
*-----------*
|7.9|.6.|..3|
|.1.|3..|79.|
|6..|59.|.1.|
|---+---+---|
|..7|..9|..5|
|.61|...|...|
|3..|...|.8.|
|---+---+---|
|.4.|..6|1..|
|2..|...|.7.|
|...|...|5.2|
*-----------*
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Re: Historical Daily 26

Postby pjb » Sun May 27, 2018 11:55 pm

Code: Select all
 7       28      9      | 1248   6      1248   | 248    5      3     
 458     1       2458   | 3      48     248    | 7      9      6     
 6       3       248    | 5      9      7      | 248    1      48     
------------------------+----------------------+---------------------
 48      28      7      |e124   d134    9      |c346   b246    5     
 9       6       1      | 248    3458   23458  | 34    b24     7     
 3       5       24     | 6      7      24     | 9      8      1     
------------------------+----------------------+---------------------
 58      4       58     | 7      2      6      | 1      3      9     
 2       9       36     |f14     1345   1345   | 68-4   7      8-4     
 1       7       36     | 9      38-4   38-4   | 5     a46     2     

(4)r9c8 = (HP 42 at r45c8) = (6-3)r4c7 = (3-1)r4c5 = r4c4 - (1=4)r8c4 => -4 r8c79, r9c56; stte

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Re: Historical Daily 26

Postby Cenoman » Mon May 28, 2018 8:15 am

Code: Select all
 +--------------------+------------------------+-------------------+
 |  7     28   9      |  1248*  6     a1248#   |  248*  5     3    |
 | d458   1   d2458   |  3     c48    c248     |  7     9     6    |
 |  6     3   e248    |  5      9      7       |  248   1    f48   |
 +--------------------+------------------------+-------------------+
 |  48    28   7      |  124    134    9       |  346*  246*  5    |
 |  9     6    1      |  248    3458   23458   |  34*   24*   7    |
 |  3     5    24     |  6      7     b24      |  9     8     1    |
 +--------------------+------------------------+-------------------+
 |  58    4    58     |  7      2      6       |  1     3     9    |
 |  2     9    36     |  1-4    1345   1345    |  468   7    g48   |
 |  1     7    36     |  9      348*   348*    |  5     46*   2    |
 +--------------------+------------------------+-------------------+

Almost grouped X-chain (*) in the 4s (rfr1c6)
X-chain [(4)r1c4*=r1c7-r45c7=r45c8-r9c8=r9c56]
(4)r1c6 - (4=2)r6c6 - (28=4)r2c56 - r2c13 = r3c3 - r3c9 = (4)r8c9
=> -4 r8c4; ste
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Re: Historical Daily 26

Postby SteveG48 » Mon May 28, 2018 2:08 pm

Code: Select all
 *---------------------------------------------------------------------*
 | 7     c28     9      |df1248   6    de1248   |c248    5      3      |
 | 458    1      2458   |  3      48    e248    | 7      9      6      |
 | 6      3      248    |  5      9      7      | 248    1     b48     |
 *----------------------+-----------------------+----------------------|
 | 48     28     7      |  124    134    9      | 346    246    5      |
 | 9      6      1      |  248    3458   23458  | 34     24     7      |
 | 3      5      24     |  6      7     e24     | 9      8      1      |
 *----------------------+-----------------------+----------------------|
 | 58     4      58     |  7      2      6      | 1      3      9      |
 | 2      9      36     |  1-4    1345   1345   | 468    7     a48     |
 | 1      7      36     |  9      348    348    | 5      46     2      |
 *---------------------------------------------------------------------*


4r8c9 = r3c9 - (4=28*)r1c27 - (2|8)r1c46 = (2r2c6)&((14)r16c6) - (1|2|*8=4)r1c4 => -4 r2c4 ; stte
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Re: Historical Daily 26

Postby SteveG48 » Mon May 28, 2018 2:55 pm

Cenoman wrote:
Code: Select all
 +--------------------+------------------------+-------------------+
 |  7     28   9      |  1248*  6     a1248#   |  248*  5     3    |
 | d458   1   d2458   |  3     c48    c248     |  7     9     6    |
 |  6     3   e248    |  5      9      7       |  248   1    f48   |
 +--------------------+------------------------+-------------------+
 |  48    28   7      |  124    134    9       |  346*  246*  5    |
 |  9     6    1      |  248    3458   23458   |  34*   24*   7    |
 |  3     5    24     |  6      7     b24      |  9     8     1    |
 +--------------------+------------------------+-------------------+
 |  58    4    58     |  7      2      6       |  1     3     9    |
 |  2     9    36     |  1-4    1345   1345    |  468   7    g48   |
 |  1     7    36     |  9      348*   348*    |  5     46*   2    |
 +--------------------+------------------------+-------------------+

Almost grouped X-chain (*) in the 4s (rfr1c6)
X-chain [(4)r1c4*=r1c7-r45c7=r45c8-r9c8=r9c56]
(4)r1c6 - (4=2)r6c6 - (28=4)r2c56 - r2c13 = r3c3 - r3c9 = (4)r8c9
=> -4 r8c4; ste


This is an interesting solution. It shows that the puzzle would be easy as a two-stepper:

(4=2)r6c6 - (2=48)r2c56 => -4 r1c6,
Then the X chain or the kite on 4s gives the key elimination.

More interesting is that Cenoman's second chain shows that if 4 is true in r1c6 then it's also true in r2c56. I don't have any problem with using the chain that way, but I think Danny Jones would have. His comments on one of the recent historicals reflect that. He called it a "selective elimination". To me it's just another way of saying that assuming that r1c6 is a 4 results in a contradiction, so -4 r1c6.
Last edited by SteveG48 on Mon May 28, 2018 3:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Historical Daily 26

Postby SteveG48 » Mon May 28, 2018 3:41 pm

So, combining Cenoman's solution with mine:

4r8c9 = r3c9 - (4=28)r1c27 - 2r1c46 = (24)r26c6 - 4r1c6 = [4r1c4 = r1c7 - r3c9 = r8c9] => -4 r8c4 ; stte
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Re: Historical Daily 26

Postby Ngisa » Mon May 28, 2018 5:22 pm

Code: Select all
+-----------------------+--------------------------+----------------------+
| 7        28      9    | 1248      6         1248 | 248      5        3  |
| 458      1       2458 | 3         48        248  | 7        9        6  |
| 6        3       248  | 5         9         7    | 248      1        48 |
+-----------------------+--------------------------+----------------------+
| 48       28      7    |b124      c134       9    |d346     f246      5  |
| 9        6       1    | 248       3458      2358 |e34      f24       7  |
| 3        5       24   | 6         7         24   | 9        8        1  |
+-----------------------+--------------------------+----------------------+
| 58       4       58   | 7         2         6    | 1        3        9  |
| 2        9       36   |a14        1345      1345 | 68-4     7        8-4|
| 1        7       36   | 9         38-4      38-4 | 5       g46       2  |
+-----------------------+--------------------------+----------------------+

Almost like Phil
(4=1)r8c4 - r4c4 = (1-3)r4c5 = r4c7 - (3=4)r5c7 - r45c8 = (4)r9c8 => - 4r8c79, r9c56; stte

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Re: Historical Daily 26

Postby Sudtyro2 » Mon May 28, 2018 6:32 pm

Code: Select all
+----------------+--------------------+---------------+
|  7   28  9     | 1248* 6    a1248#  |  248* 5   3   |
| d458 1  d2458  | 3    c48   c248    |  7    9   6   |
|  6   3  e248   | 5     9     7      |  248  1  f48* |
+----------------+--------------------+---------------+
|  48  28  7     | 124   134   9      |  346  246 5   |
|  9   6   1     | 248   3458  23458  |  34   24  7   |
|  3   5   24    | 6     7    b24     |  9    8   1   |
+----------------+--------------------+---------------+
|  58  4   58    | 7     2     6      |  1    3   9   |
|  2   9   36    | 1-4   1345  1345   |  468  7  g48* |
|  1   7   36    | 9     348   348    |  5    46  2   |
+----------------+--------------------+---------------+
In 4s, an almost kite(*) with one spoiler(#) => - 4r8c4; stte
4r1c6 - (4=2)r6c6 - (2=84)r2c56 - r2c13 = r3c3 - r3c9 = 4r8c9

Ouch! Too similar to Cenoman's?

Added:
FWIW, this solution started, in 4s, as a 5-link oddagon (the kite plus the elimination cell) and having seven guardians:
Code: Select all
4r1c6 - (4=2)r6c6 - (2=84)r2c56 - r2c13 = r3c3 - r3c9 = r8c9 - 4r8c4; 
4r3c7                                          - r3c9 = r8c9 - 4r8c4; 
4r45c4,r8c567                                                - 4r8c4;
Then it seemed simpler to just call it an almost kite and keep the one spoiler!

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Re: Historical Daily 26

Postby Leren » Mon May 28, 2018 8:25 pm

Link to the original puzzle is here. Leren
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Re: Historical Daily 26

Postby SteveG48 » Tue May 29, 2018 12:57 am

I haven't tried to puzzle out the morphing, but I suspect that the 2 stepper that I posted above is the same as the one posted by DAJ back when. (!)
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Re: Historical Daily 26

Postby Cenoman » Tue May 29, 2018 8:39 am

SteveG48 wrote:This is an interesting solution. It shows that the puzzle would be easy as a two-stepper:

(4=2)r6c6 - (2=48)r2c56 => -4 r1c6,
Then the X chain or the kite on 4s gives the key elimination.

So, combining Cenoman's solution with mine:

4r8c9 = r3c9 - (4=28)r1c27 - 2r1c46 = (24)r26c6 - 4r1c6 = [4r1c4 = r1c7 - r3c9 = r8c9] => -4 r8c4 ; stte


@SteveG

Thank you for reading so deeply my path. I had seen the elimination of 4r1c6 by the subchain (4=2)r6c6 - (2=84)r2c56, and therefore the simple two stepper.

I felt uneasy with this, and I agree with the way it is discussed in the original thread.
Eventually, your "combined solution" solves elegantly the issue !

Sudtyro2 wrote:In 4s, an almost kite(*) with one spoiler(#) => - 4r8c4; stte
4r1c6 - (4=2)r6c6 - (2=84)r2c56 - r2c13 = r3c3 - r3c9 = 4r8c9

Ouch! Too similar to Cenoman's?


@SteveC

your fin chain is the same, but your X-chain is much better.
I used the principle "Why do it simple when you can do it complex !"
Nevertheless, your first solution has the same concern as mine. See SeveG's comments, and all exchanges in the original thread.

@Leren

Thank you for selecting such interesting puzzles.
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