The New Sudoku Players' Forum

by **daj95376** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:26 pm

wapati wrote:Brutal.

Code: Select all
. . 8|. 5 .|7 . . . . .|2 . 9|5 . . 5 . .|8 . .|. 9 6 -----+-----+----- . 7 9|. 2 .|. 5 . 3 . .|5 . 8|. . 2 . 2 .|. 1 .|4 3 . -----+-----+----- 9 8 .|. . 4|. . 5 . . 6|1 . 5|. . . . . 7|. 8 .|3 . .

Two Kraken X-Wings, in <6> then <1>, were my primary stumbling blocks. Yes, brutal does a good job of describing it.

by **udosuk** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:27 pm

Thanks Carcul... So the AUR's isn't really necessary (the singles following the UR type 1 already cover those eliminations)...

On Dec 15th, this is what you wrote:BUGs are not needed here. Uniqueness is enough.

I suppose you meant 2 UR/AURs were enough to solve this puzzle? I don't really want to spend more time figuring them out now (heaps of Christmas stuffs to do)... If you don't wanna spoil others, could you please send me a PM, specifically demonstrating which 2 SIMPLE moves you used to crack this puzzle? Please do it for the Christmas spirit... THANKS! :!:

by **Carcul** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:40 pm

Wapati wrote:Nasty puzzle.

Code: Select all: *---------------------------------------------------------------------* | 13468 468 13468 | 1268 5 128 | 9 346 7 | | 56 9 2 | 4 7 3 | 56 1 8 | | 134568 7 134568 | 168 9 18 | 356 2 346 | |------------------------+----------------------+---------------------| | 1348 5 1348 | 1238 6 1248 | 7 9 23 | | 9 48 7 | 5 23 48 | 236 36 1 | | 136 2 136 | 9 13 7 | 4 8 5 | |------------------------+----------------------+---------------------| | 2 468 468 | 13 134 5 | 136 7 9 | | 457 1 9 | 237 234 6 | 8 345 234 | | 4567 3 456 | 127 8 9 | 126 456 246 | *---------------------------------------------------------------------*

-3-[r23c7](-6-[r3c9|r5c7])-6-[r7c7]=6|4=[r7c5]-4-[r8c5]-{TITILA}.
So, r3c7=3 and the puzzle is solved.

Carcul

by **Mike Barker** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 2:46 pm

Udosuk, A second UR is not clear to me. There are at least 3 easy one step moves that crack the puzzle. A finned X-wing, an XY-wing, or an empty rectangle. Focus on r3c8.

Merry Christmas.

by **claudiarabia** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 3:36 pm

Code: Select all: . . 3 8 . . 2 . . . 5 . . 4 . . 9 . 6 . . . . 1 . . . 8 . . . . . 4 . . . 2 . . 9 . . 6 . . . 6 . . . . . 1 . . . 7 . . . . 3 . 9 . . 2 . . 4 . 3 . 4 . . 6 1 . .

claudia

by **udosuk** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 3:18 am

Mike Barker wrote:Udosuk, A second UR is not clear to me. There are at least 3 easy one step moves that crack the puzzle. A finned X-wing, an XY-wing, or an empty rectangle. Focus on r3c8.

Mike,
There is no 2nd UR, but Carcul already demonstrated to me his super "uniqueness" trick privately which I can't disclose here without his permission... I'll show your 3 "easy one step moves" below plus another one (a remote pair):

Code: Select all: *--------------------------------------------------* | 12 8 12 |*46 7 34 |#56 *356 9 | | 4 3 6 | 5 1 9 | 78 2 78 | | 7 9 5 | 2 68 38 | 4 -36 1 | |----------------+----------------+----------------| | 235 1 237 | 8 4 6 | 57 9 27 | | 58 4 9 | 17 2 17 | 3 58 6 | | 28 6 27 | 3 9 5 | 1 4 278 | |----------------+----------------+----------------| | 6 2 8 | 47 3 47 | 9 1 5 | | 13 5 134 | 9 68 2 | 68 7 34 | | 9 7 34 |*16 5 18 | 2 *68 34 | *--------------------------------------------------*

Finned X-wing: either r1c7=6 or r19c48 form an x-wing of 6, so r3c8<>6

Code: Select all: *--------------------------------------------------* | 12 8 12 | 46 7 34 | 56 356 9 | | 4 3 6 | 5 1 9 | 78 2 78 | | 7 9 5 | 2 68 *38 | 4 *36 1 | |----------------+----------------+----------------| | 235 1 237 | 8 4 6 | 57 9 27 | | 58 4 9 | 17 2 17 | 3 58 6 | | 28 6 27 | 3 9 5 | 1 4 278 | |----------------+----------------+----------------| | 6 2 8 | 47 3 47 | 9 1 5 | | 13 5 134 | 9 68 2 | 68 7 34 | | 9 7 34 | 16 5 -18 | 2 *68 34 | *--------------------------------------------------*

XY-wing: r9c6<>8 (otherwise r3c8 will have no candidate)

Code: Select all: *--------------------------------------------------* | 12 8 12 | 46 7 34 | 56 356 9 | | 4 3 6 | 5 1 9 | 78 2 78 | | 7 9 5 | 2 @68 38 | 4 -36 1 | |----------------+----------------+----------------| | 235 1 237 | 8 4 6 | 57 9 27 | | 58 4 9 | 17 2 17 | 3 58 6 | | 28 6 27 | 3 9 5 | 1 4 278 | |----------------+----------------+----------------| | 6 2 8 | 47 3 47 |#9 1 #5 | | 13 5 134 | 9 @68 2 | 68 7 34 | | 9 7 34 | 16 5 18 |#2 68 #34 | *--------------------------------------------------*

Empty Rectangle: r79c79 don't have 6 + strong link of 6 in r38c5 => r3c8<>6

Code: Select all: *--------------------------------------------------* | 12 8 12 | 46 7 34 | 56 356 9 | | 4 3 6 | 5 1 9 | 78 2 78 | | 7 9 5 | 2 *68 38 | 4 -36 1 | |----------------+----------------+----------------| | 235 1 237 | 8 4 6 | 57 9 27 | | 58 4 9 | 17 2 17 | 3 58 6 | | 28 6 27 | 3 9 5 | 1 4 278 | |----------------+----------------+----------------| | 6 2 8 | 47 3 47 | 9 1 5 | | 13 5 134 | 9 *68 2 |*68 7 34 | | 9 7 34 | 16 5 18 | 2 *68 34 | *--------------------------------------------------*

Remote Pair: r3c5={68}=r8c5={68}=r8c7={68}=r9c8 => r3c8<>6,8

by **ronk** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 4:21 am

udosuk wrote:Please give more helpful advices other than "look closer"...

Your persistence and patience with Carcul's riddles amazes me.

by **udosuk** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 7:26 am

ronk wrote:Your persistence and patience with Carcul's riddles amazes me.

Not every riddle, just this one and perhaps another from a very long time ago... For the others I didn't bother much...

I didn't view it as a riddle anyway... Just trying to figure out a move along his descriptions... At the end I failed miserably...

by **wapati** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 5:20 am

Pretty horrible.

Code: Select all: . 5 . | . . 2 | . . . 4 . . | . . . | 9 . . . . . | . 8 . | . 5 4 --------------------- . . . | . 9 4 | . . 2 . . 2 | 6 . . | . 8 5 3 . . | 2 . . | 6 . . --------------------- . 3 . | . . 5 | . . 6 . . 4 | . 2 . | . . . . . 6 | 8 7 . | 1 . .

by **wapati** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 5:43 am

Nasty puzzle.

Code: Select all: 5 . . | . . 2 | 7 . . . . 2 | . 1 . | . 4 3 . 8 . | 9 4 . | . 5 . --------------------- . . 5 | . . . | . . 1 . 1 7 | . . . | 4 2 . 8 . . | . . . | . . . --------------------- 9 . . | . 2 . | . . . . 7 3 | . 8 . | . . 6 . 2 . | 3 . . | . 7 .

by **Carcul** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 10:51 am

Wapati wrote:Pretty horrible.

Code: Select all: *-------------------------------------------------------------* | 179 5 1379 | 13479 134 2 | 8 6 137 | | 4 17 8 | 5 6 137 | 9 2 137 | | 2 6 1379 | 1379 8 1379 | 37 5 4 | |--------------------+--------------------+-------------------| | 6 8 5 | 17 9 4 | 37 13 2 | | 179 179 2 | 6 13 137 | 4 8 5 | | 3 4 17 | 2 5 8 | 6 19 79 | |--------------------+--------------------+-------------------| | 8 3 179 | 149 14 5 | 2 79 6 | | 179 179 4 | 139 2 6 | 5 379 8 | | 5 2 6 | 8 7 39 | 1 4 39 | *-------------------------------------------------------------*

[r7c3]=9=[r8c8](-9-[r8c12])-9-[r9c9](=9=[r9c6]-9-[r7c4])-3-[r12c9]
(=3|9=[r1c1]-9-[r1c4|r3c3|r5c1])=3=[r3c7]-3-[r3c3]=3=[r1c3]-3-[r1c45]
=3=[r2c6]-2-[r5c6]-{TILA-I-UR}, => r8c8<>9 => r7c3=9 and the puzzle is solved.

Carcul

by **daj95376** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:13 pm

wapati wrote:Pretty horrible.

Code: Select all
. 5 . | . . 2 | . . . 4 . . | . . . | 9 . . . . . | . 8 . | . 5 4 --------------------- . . . | . 9 4 | . . 2 . . 2 | 6 . . | . 8 5 3 . . | 2 . . | 6 . . --------------------- . 3 . | . . 5 | . . 6 . . 4 | . 2 . | . . . . . 6 | 8 7 . | 1 . .

Not too bad before/after ...

Code: Select all: # finned Jellyfish [r1258C1269] in <1> => [r7c5]=1 => [r7c34]<>1 *--------------------------------------------------------------------* |*179 5 1379 | 3479-1 4-1 2 | 8 6 *17 | | 4 *17 8 | 5 6 *137 | 9 2 *137 | | 2 6 1379 | 1379 8 f179 | 37 5 4 | |----------------------+----------------------+----------------------| | 6 8 5 | 17 9 4 | 37 13 2 | |*179 *179 2 | 6 3 *17 | 4 8 5 | | 3 4 17 | 2 5 8 | 6 19 79 | |----------------------+----------------------+----------------------| | 8 3 9-1 | 49-1 1-4 5 | 2 7 6 | |*179 *179 4 | 39-1 2 6 | 5 39 8 | | 5 2 6 | 8 7 39 | 1 4 39 | *--------------------------------------------------------------------*

by **claudiarabia** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 4:37 am

Code: Select all: 2 . . 4 . . . . 9 . 5 . . 8 . . 6 . . . 9 . . 3 4 . . 8 . . . . . 6 . 2 . . 1 . . 8 . . . 6 . . . . . 7 . 1 . . 3 . . 4 2 . . . 7 . . 3 . . 1 . 1 . . 8 . . . . 4

This one has BUG 2 , x-wing, xy-wing, an y-cycle and a turbot fish. Do you consider cycles as forcing chains?

Claudia

by **Carcul** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 2:33 pm

Claudiarabia wrote:This one has BUG 2 , x-wing, xy-wing, an y-cycle and a turbot fish.

Code: Select all: *------------------------------------------------------* | 2 168 68 | 4 157 1567 | 38 35 9 | | 3 5 4 | 29 8 29 | 1 6 7 | | 7 168 9 | 156 15 3 | 4 2 58 | |-----------------+------------------+-----------------| | 8 34 7 | 135 145 15 | 6 9 2 | | 9 2 1 | 7 6 8 | 5 4 3 | | 6 34 5 | 239 249 29 | 7 8 1 | |-----------------+------------------+-----------------| | 5 689 3 | 169 19 4 | 2 7 68 | | 4 7 268 | 2569 3 56 | 89 1 568 | | 1 69 26 | 8 2579 567 | 39 35 4 | *------------------------------------------------------*

[r9c5]-2-[r6c5]=2|9=[r6c5]-9-[r7c5]-1-[r3c5]-5-[r3c9]=5=[r8c9]-5-
-[r7c45|r8c46]-2-[r9c5], => r9c5<>2 solving the puzzle.

Carcul

by **ronk** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 3:00 pm

claudiarabia wrote:
Code: Select all
2 . . 4 . . . . 9 . 5 . . 8 . . 6 . . . 9 . . 3 4 . . 8 . . . . . 6 . 2 . . 1 . . 8 . . . 6 . . . . . 7 . 1 . . 3 . . 4 2 . . . 7 . . 3 . . 1 . 1 . . 8 . . . . 4

This one has BUG 2 , x-wing, xy-wing, an y-cycle and a turbot fish. Do you consider cycles as forcing chains?

What is a "BUG 2"? [A pencilmark grid illustrating the "BUG 2" for this puzzle would be appreciated.]

TIA, Ron

The New Sudoku Players' Forum

CHAINS, not required. Good puzzles.

x-wing, xy-wing and BUG Type 1

a cycle

Re: a cycle