Bossdoku

For fans of Killer Sudoku, Samurai Sudoku and other variants

Bossdoku

Postby udosuk » Wed Apr 02, 2008 6:26 am

Ages since I last visited here. My former co-moderator, grandmaster Ruud, is currently taking a long break from sudoku-web stuffs. I guess sometimes we all need a break ourselves.:?:

Anyway, I've recently been active in djape's forum, and this is what I just came up with:

http://www.djape.net/sudoku/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1255

Here are some small examples (I dub them "Minibossdoku puzzles"):

Image

Image

Image

Here is the rule I wrote:Defintion:

A Bossanova cell is a cell which holds the sum of gaps (i.e. absolute difference) between itself and its orthogonal neighbours.

In a standard Bossdoku puzzle all Bossanova cells are shaded in grey. White cells must not be Bossanova cells.


Well, given nobody has shown any interest in the Bossanova puzzles link:

http://forum.enjoysudoku.com/viewtopic.php?t=5685

... posted almost 1/2 years ago, I don't expect much enthusiasm here.

Well, just post the thread and let it sink I suppose?:(
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Postby EnderGT » Thu Apr 03, 2008 1:11 pm

I'm not understanding these puzzles.

given a puzzle like:

B X Y
V . .
W . .

is it B = (X-Y) + (W-V)

or is it B = (B-X) + (B-V)

or is it something else entirely

Also, on other threads, solutions seem to have been given that still have empty squares... other solutions don't seem to fit either of the above rules.

Does making it "bossdoku" instead of "Bossanova" mean that sudoku rules apply? i.e. a number must occur once and only once per row/column/box?

much of the discussion of these puzzles on the other threads has been way over my head...
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Postby udosuk » Fri Apr 04, 2008 4:29 am

EnderGT wrote:I'm not understanding these puzzles.

given a puzzle like:

B X Y
V . .
W . .

is it B = (X-Y) + (W-V)

or is it B = (B-X) + (B-V)

or is it something else entirely

B = |B-X| + |B-V|

I'm sure your've learned this in your maths class:
Code: Select all
|P-Q| = P-Q if P>Q or P=Q
      = Q-P if P<Q

By "gap" I mean "absolute value of difference".

EnderGT wrote:Also, on other threads, solutions seem to have been given that still have empty squares... other solutions don't seem to fit either of the above rules.

Can you give specific examples? All solutions should have every square filled. Please give me a link to solutions "that still have empty squares".

EnderGT wrote:Does making it "bossdoku" instead of "Bossanova" mean that sudoku rules apply? i.e. a number must occur once and only once per row/column/box?

Yes exactly. And if I state it's a "Latin Square" it means there are only rows/columns but no boxes where numbers cannot repeat. By "X" I mean it's a diagonal puzzle (numbers cannot repeat along the 2 main diagonals). By "AK" I mean "Anti-King" (cells diagonally adjacent cannot hold the same number).
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Postby EnderGT » Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:13 pm

udosuk wrote:B = |B-X| + |B-V|

Absolute value I have no problem with, it's the "orthogonal neighbors" part that I wanted clarification on.

Edit: hadn't had my coffee yet when I wrote what I deleted here.

udosuk wrote:Can you give specific examples? All solutions should have every square filled. Please give me a link to solutions "that still have empty squares".


http://www.djape.net/sudoku/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8156#p8156

Thinking about this, though, as I can't see the referenced gif, this may have simply been a Bossanova, not a Bossdoku.

udosuk wrote:By "AK" I mean "Anti-King" (cells diagonally adjacent cannot hold the same number).


This is good to know, thanks. A couple of other acronyms I've seen are NC and AN?
Last edited by EnderGT on Fri Apr 04, 2008 12:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby tarek » Fri Apr 04, 2008 3:54 pm

Beginning the mental exercise:
Minibossudoku1: Why do I get 2 solutions
312231123 & 321132213 ?
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Postby tarek » Fri Apr 04, 2008 3:56 pm

oops now I get it,

White cells MUST NOT BE bossudoku cells (or they would have been shaded gray) .... so a single solution then:D

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Postby EnderGT » Fri Apr 04, 2008 4:30 pm

tarek wrote:oops now I get it,

White cells MUST NOT BE bossudoku cells (or they would have been shaded gray) .... so a single solution then:D

tarek


Don't think either of your solutions are correct... I got

231
312
123

as the only answer for #1.

For your first answer, r1c3 and r3c3 are also B cells, for your second, r3c1 and r3c3 are.

For #2 I get:

2341
1423
4132
3214


And for #3:

3 4 5 2 1
5 2 1 3 4
1 3 4 5 2
4 5 2 1 3
2 1 3 4 5


Very interesting concept.
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Postby udosuk » Sat Apr 05, 2008 2:45 am

EnderGT wrote:
udosuk wrote:Can you give specific examples? All solutions should have every square filled. Please give me a link to solutions "that still have empty squares".

http://www.djape.net/sudoku/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8156#p8156

Thinking about this, though, as I can't see the referenced gif, this may have simply been a Bossanova, not a Bossdoku.

That is indeed a pure Bossanova puzzle. The x's you see in the solution grid are outside the boundary of the playing grid, not empty cells. The original puzzle grid can be found in here:

http://h-syouyuyaki.blog.drecom.jp/archive/210

EnderGT wrote:
udosuk wrote:By "AK" I mean "Anti-King" (cells diagonally adjacent cannot hold the same number).

This is good to know, thanks. A couple of other acronyms I've seen are NC and AN?

NC = Non-Consecutive, i.e. cells orthogonally adjacent must not be consecutive
(e.g. if r5c5=5, then r4c5,r5c4,r5c6,r6c5 all can't be 4 or 6)

AN = Anti-kNight, i.e. cells a knight's move apart can't be the same
(e.g. if r5c5=5, then r3c4,r3c6,r4c3,r4c7,r6c3,r6c7,r7c4,r7c6 all can't be 5)



tarek, see? I suggested these as exercises for your "carefully reading the questions before attempting to answer", obviously you haven't been careful enough.:D But I guarantee you're not the only one making that mistake. As you can see from my link another exceptionally smart puzzle master (JC) also did the same thing.:)



EnderGT, you have defeated all 3 minibosses excellently (BTW you can read my walkthroughs for them through my link at the top). Now you are qualified to challenge my "official" Bossdoku puzzles (there are 7 of them as of now). I suggest you try #5 first. It should be far easier than all others.:idea:
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Postby tarek » Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:37 pm

EnderGT wrote:Don't think either of your solutions are correct
Thank you for reminding me:D . As udosuk is enjoying his torture session, the last thing I need is some extra voltage:D

On the serious side, these are very enjoyable puzzle with a nice concept.

With this sudoku hybrid, you can probably have a cluless 9*9 with enough gray cells.

The gray cells could show some form of symmetry for an aesthetic touch.

good work udosuk.

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Postby EnderGT » Sun Apr 06, 2008 2:20 am

tarek wrote:
EnderGT wrote:Don't think either of your solutions are correct
Thank you for reminding me:D . As udosuk is enjoying his torture session, the last thing I need is some extra voltage:D

Sorry:)

These puzzles are a bit ridiculous... took me like 4-5 tries to get the third one, I kept missing possible number placements.

Still, they make you think differently, and that's always good.
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Postby udosuk » Mon Apr 07, 2008 2:44 am

tarek wrote:With this sudoku hybrid, you can probably have a cluless 9*9 with enough gray cells.

If for some reason you don't want to click into my link above, here is one I posted there:

Image

Only one grey cell but it's a variant with NC AK AN properties.

I think one can create a puzzle with no extra property and only a handful of grey cells.

tarek wrote:The gray cells could show some form of symmetry for an aesthetic touch.

This is a 6x6 one with diagonal symmetry, and no extra property at all (i.e. only row/column/block):

Image

tarek wrote:On the serious side, these are very enjoyable puzzle with a nice concept... good work udosuk.

Thanks!:) And thanks for taking the "torture session" so nicely. I'm sure you'll get your chance!:D
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re: Moderator

Postby Pat » Thu Apr 10, 2008 9:03 am

udosuk wrote:Ages since I last visited here.

My former co-Moderator, grandmaster Ruud, is currently taking a long break from sudoku-web stuffs.

I guess sometimes we all need a break ourselves.

I've recently been active in djape's forum---



[ Off-Topic ]

hey udosuk, are you really back to Forum activity ?
    perhaps we can get you to resume your role as Moderator
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Re: re: Moderator

Postby udosuk » Sat Apr 12, 2008 4:28 am

Pat wrote:[ Off-Topic ]

hey udosuk, are you really back to Forum activity ?
    perhaps we can get you to resume your role as Moderator

Sorry, can't afford the time.:(
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Postby HATMAN » Sat Apr 12, 2008 1:21 pm

Solution for #6

Nice one Matt - I even managed it on paper

451236
623415
234561
165342
546123
312654
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Postby udosuk » Sat Apr 12, 2008 6:23 pm

HATMAN wrote:Solution for #6

Nice one Matt - I even managed it on paper

451236
623415
234561
165342
546123
312654

Great job Maurice!:) I actually have some more to offer, but from the lack of response in the djape thread I assumed nobody was interested.:(

You should try #4 or #7. They're a bit tougher than this one.:) Anyway the walkthroughs/solutions are already available.
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