The Effortless Extremes thread

Everything about Sudoku that doesn't fit in one of the other sections

Postby fermat » Wed Jun 21, 2006 11:53 am

Here is one that requires a Turbot Fish.
Code: Select all
4 . . | . . . | . . 7
. . 9 | 7 . 6 | 2 . .
. 8 . | 4 . 9 | . 3 .
---------------------
. 2 6 | 1 . 3 | 4 9 .
. . . | . . . | . . .
. 1 4 | 5 . 7 | 6 2 .
---------------------
. 4 . | 8 . 1 | . 5 .
. . 5 | 2 . 4 | 8 . .
8 . . | . . . | . . 2
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Postby tso » Wed Jun 21, 2006 5:50 pm

I'm not clear on the concept. Does this one (previously posted in another thread) fit the theme:

Code: Select all
+-------+-------+-------+
| . 1 5 | 2 4 . | . . . |
| . 2 . | . 1 8 | 6 4 5 |
| . 6 . | . . . | . . 8 |
+-------+-------+-------+
| . 3 . | . . . | . . 6 |
| 6 9 . | . . . | . 7 3 |
| 5 . . | . . . | . 8 . |
+-------+-------+-------+
| 4 . . | . . . | . 5 . |
| 2 8 9 | 7 3 . | . 6 . |
| . . . | . 2 1 | 8 9 . |
+-------+-------+-------+


All singles, then either BUG or a 5 cell XY-chain.
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Postby RW » Thu Jun 22, 2006 8:22 am

I'm afraid most of the techniques based on strong links (skyscraper, turbot fish etc.) can also be done by coloring or multiple colors, which is against the initial rules. Therefore none of fermats puzzle passed the test. If you wish to test them easily yourself, just copypaste into SS and hold down <F11>. If the program gives you "no hint available" and there is no obvious UR-reductions at that point it might pass. As ronk already pointed out, gsf's puzzle could be solved with x-wing and xy-wing. Tso's puzzle would qualify, I'll add it to the list.

RW
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Postby gsf » Thu Jun 22, 2006 4:24 pm

this one solves in 11 steps
the 6th is a length 9 xy-cycle
Code: Select all
[17]7[97]9[89]3[82]9[92]2[93]4[73]7[23]8[28]7[17]7

the rest are singles
Code: Select all
# effortless extreme VII 11 steps 26 clues diagonal symmetric minimal

5 . .  6 . .  . . .
9 4 .  2 . .  3 . .
. 6 .  7 . 8  . 4 .

3 . 9  . . .  8 . .
4 . .  . . .  . . .
. . 6  . . .  1 3 2

. . .  9 . 5  . . .
. . .  . . .  2 1 .
. . .  . 3 6  . 5 7
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Postby RW » Thu Jun 22, 2006 6:39 pm

gsf wrote:this one solves in 11 steps
the 6th is a length 9 xy-cycle


Code: Select all
 *--------------------------------------------------*
 | 5    178  178  | 6    4    3    | 79   2    89   |
 | 9    4    78   | 2    5    1    | 3   *678 *68   |
 | 2    6    3    | 7    9    8    | 5    4    1    |
 |----------------+----------------+----------------|
 | 3    12   9    | 5    16   27   | 8    67   4    |
 | 4    128  128  | 3    16   27   | 67   9    5    |
 | 7    5    6    | 4    8    9    | 1    3    2    |
 |----------------+----------------+----------------|
 | 1    37   47   | 9    2    5    | 46  *68  -368  |
 | 6    39   5    | 8    7    4    | 2    1    39   |
 | 8    29   24   | 1    3    6    | 49   5    7    |
 *--------------------------------------------------*


Sorry, the UR in r27c89 eliminates candidates 6 and 8 from r7c9 to solve the puzzle... But keep on making those puzzles!:)

RW
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Postby gsf » Thu Jun 22, 2006 7:20 pm

I'm confused
RW wrote:Sorry, the UR in r27c89 eliminates candidates 6 and 8 from r7c9 to solve the puzzle... But keep on making those puzzles!:)

from the first message wrote:[edit: I decided to count Uniqueness rectangles as an "advanced technique"]

btw, the xy-cycle makes the same elimination
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Postby RW » Thu Jun 22, 2006 9:01 pm

gsf wrote:I'm confused

I've tried to classify the puzzles by technique, even though I know it's impossible to make a puzzle that requires a certain technique. As I decided to count URs as an "advanced technique" I started keeping a separate list of puzzles that could be solved with URs.
I also wrote:I wouldn't let a puzzle that can be solved with an uniqueness rectangle on the list under any other technique.

I think your puzzle is a lot easier to solve with the UR, that's why I wouldn't classify it as a puzzle that requires a length 9 xy-cycle as you suggested.

The problem with adding it to the UR category is that I'm not quite sure if I can count the UR as one advanced step. The two candidates are eliminated by two different kinds of patterns, even though they happen to be eliminated from the same cell by a rectangle in the same four cells. Candidate '6' is eliminated by what Mike Barker classifies as a "UR+2D/1SL" here. Candidate '8' doesn't have the strong link and is eliminated by the pattern I've described here. It is very possible that someone sees the first elimination and not the second, therefore it doesn't fulfill the requirement of one advanced move. It's a tricky situation and I'll have to think about it for a while.

RW
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Postby gsf » Thu Jun 22, 2006 10:57 pm

RW wrote:
gsf wrote:I'm confused

I've tried to classify the puzzles by technique, even though I know it's impossible to make a puzzle that requires a certain technique. As I decided to count URs as an "advanced technique" I started keeping a separate list of puzzles that could be solved with URs.

so you don't want to see UR solvable puzzles in this thread?
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Postby ronk » Fri Jun 23, 2006 12:23 pm

RW wrote:The two candidates are eliminated by two different kinds of patterns, even though they happen to be eliminated from the same cell by a rectangle in the same four cells.
Code: Select all
 5   178 178 | 6   4   3   | 79  2    89
 9   4   78  | 2   5   1   | 3  *678 *68
 2   6   3   | 7   9   8   | 5   4    1
-------------+-------------+-------------
 3   12  9   | 5   16  27  | 8   67   4
 4   128 128 | 3   16  27  | 67  9    5
 7   5   6   | 4   8   9   | 1   3    2
-------------+-------------+-------------
 1   37  47  | 9   2   5   | 46 *68  *368
 6   39  5   | 8   7   4   | 2   1    39
 8   29  24  | 1   3   6   | 49  5    7

At Simple Sudoku's sticking point, the {68} uniqueness rectangle in r27c89 has four strong links, two for digit 6 in r2 & c9, and two for digit 8 in r7 & c8. I view the exclusions r2c8<>6,8 and r7c9<>6,8 as four applications of the "UR+2D/1SL" technique in a "single step".
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Postby RW » Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:43 am

gsf, in the original post there are UR-solvable puzzles in their own category. Sorry if a bad choice of terminology confused you.

Ronk, you're right, I missed the strong linnks in the columns. I'm not very used to look for SLs as such. I'll add the puzzle in the UR category.

RW
Last edited by RW on Sun Jun 25, 2006 6:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby pyrpoliser » Sat Jun 24, 2006 1:48 pm

Edited
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Postby Mike Barker » Sun Jun 25, 2006 4:55 am

Here are a bunch ranging from the basic to the esoteric which I hope fit the bill, have the number of nodes in an XY-chain correct, and balance UR's and XY-chains. The numbers in the front are my method of keeping track of the technique and can be ignored.
Code: Select all
11 Finned Swordfish
....2.6.8.......15.57....4..........6.8.4.....32..79...9.2..37.....18...36.......
..8..7964..96...........7.......1.3.7..2.41...6.5.........5....5....2.83.463....7

11 Franken Swordfish
1........79.....4.....37...51.4..7.9...38.......1..8......2...3.75.......6...4.5.
8...5..41......5...4.....6345.1......3.7.......12..6.512.3..4........7....3.9..2.

12 Franken Jellyfish
......5..87.5.4.9..3..9.....6..5...9.8....746.........4.1....2....4..1.7...8.....

12 Franken Jellyfish (2 per puzzle)
..1...9......2...54.81.9.7..1..63..8..7.......3..1....2..7..15....6..82.3........
..5......94..7.....165.9..4....9...8.....7..21.3...67...7..4..639.......6..1.5...

18 Two strong links (Turbot Fish)
6...3.2..3..71..8...7..23.1...4......416.....82....1..4......5.1...739........6..

19 Three strong links (Turbot Chain)
1........746.....2...3..65.971..2.....2....16.....4.......8..2..9...13..58..4.... >
...64.5..54...3.8......7......89....1...6..3..97...6..9.5.......3..5.1.9......7..

22 XYZ-wing
..1....5.....85.74..39..8..5..7.81...8..6...5...4...2..........6.7.4......5..9..3
...8..6...1.9..82...56..3...52.....38....4.1.....5.2..2.....1....64.....5...27..4

23 WXYZ-wing
.2.13.9.795......4......1..18..7....3.....476...36.2......8..6.5...1.....4......3
.7......9....4.1.61.....28...36.......8423...5.6..8...3.....8...4..8.69....5....1

24 VWXYZ-wing
.8.5.......1......9..1.45..7.2..316.....1.7.5.....93.4........6...8..9...147.....
.......6..93.8......6.49......37....182...7.........1..1..538........67.36..981..

25 UVWYXZ-wing
.4..9...76.85....2..5....8....2..7..41..36........1.3.2..3...1.9...4.........9.2.
.9......4..78.....4..7.21.8..9.5.....6....54..7...1.6..51.....39..1.8.5....5..2.6

26 TUVWXYZ-wing
2.....93...57..........3..41..2....5.4....61...7........3..426..68.2...........9.

27 4-node XY-ring
.13.....4...61...2.2....8..4...5...1..5.4.23.6.....5.9..1.28....9.4........9...7.
........4...8..7...76....151....2.56.2.93....4..........9...4.72...6.3......1....

28 5-node XY-chain
3.2.6.7..1.4..7.2...5....3.4..3....5......2.......9..8.....28...56..4...7...5.1..

30 6-node XY-chain
.1.2...4..9.....3.5..4................75..1.8..68.1...3...2.8......6..2.85..4...3
.6..98.4.31.......5.8....3...1..6.........4.....1825.....245..7...9..6.1..7...2..

32 7-node XY-chain
.9..8..7....3...5265.4.....8.7..31.61........9..8.4.......6.4.778..........2.....

9-node XY-chain
....126.7.59....32.......8.7..........84...7...58.912..9.7582....6.4...5.4.......

33 ALS xz-rule
9..2...8.24.........8.4...9......3.8.......7....591...6...7.......8..6...71..6.54
.7.5.....4..19....51.....9..43.2..1...8....26.2.3....5.......8....7...5179......2

35 UR+1 (Type 1)
..32.....4...........8.7..5...675...95.4..7..8.1.3..6.....96.7...7...8...9......2
.47.........9....698...5.72..5.7..6.3.4......27.5............9.....16..7.62..84..

36 UR+2x (Type 2)
...9.7..8....6....72.5...9..83...6....2....3.4....37...9....14..1...2..6....56...
896.4..........7.2...9...6..18..9.246..3...8..3..1.......4..2..3....6.....5.3..1.

38 UR+2X (Type 3/3B) (8-node XY-chain)
............3..6......742...34.5.9.2.7.4..5.1.........8.5.16..36..........7.9...8

38 UR+2X (Type 3/3B)
.7...342.9.2........4..765...697...8...1.5.....76........2.8.94....5...7......2..

39 UR+2rd
...4.3.7.53..............469........8....74.2...36..1..7.18..6..5..2.....4...57..
8..3....19.2.........56...4..8..4.65...7....32.6..........1........8.5427........

40 UR+2kx
.2...8.....5...2..7...1...6.......2.938.2......74.58.....1.97....95..6..6...83..4

41 UR+4X/1SL (Type 4)
.....2..4..17..8...4..6..3.4.6.....53.7....8......9.....9.18..21......5..5...476.

42 UR+3N/2SL
.....49.623.7........5....11.........4....8...5...36.99....8......1..3.7..2..9.4.

42 UR+3C/2SL (8-node XY-chain)
2.1.....8.....3..........626.3..7....52.947..7..3..1..4....6.519..5...4...7.1....

42 UR+3C/2SL
.....15...453.........9.468..8..3..99..2.7.......5..266......4142.........9.....3

50 BUG+1 (8-node XY-chain)
..8...2..9.......72.7....934...9...6....2.........31.5.....8....5.43.....6...7.84
+-------------+--------------+-------------+
|  5   34   8 |  39   7   49 |   2   6   1 |
|  9   13   6 |  23  48   12 |  48   5   7 |
|  2   14   7 |  18 *56  *56 |  48   9   3 |
+-------------+--------------+-------------+
|  4   28  35 |  18   9   15 |   7  23   6 |
|  1    7  35 | *56   2 -456 |   9  34   8 |
|  6  289  29 |   7  48    3 |   1  24   5 |
+-------------+--------------+-------------+
|  7   29   4 | *56 *56    8 |   3   1  29 |
|  8    5   1 |   4   3   29 |   6   7  29 |
|  3    6  29 |  29   1    7 |   5   8   4 |
+-------------+--------------+-------------+

51 BUG+x (Type 2/2B)
3.....4.........8..9..4.1.........7...8..6.....4.796...7.9.83...4.32....25...1...
+-------------+------------+--------------+
|   3  8 *256 |   7  1 *25 |  4 -256    9 |
|   4  1  *25 |   6  9   3 |  7    8  *25 |
| -56  9    7 |   8  4 *25 |  1    3 *256 |
+-------------+------------+--------------+
|   9  6   15 |  15  8   4 |  2    7    3 |
|   7  2    8 |  15  3   6 |  9  145  145 |
|  15  3    4 |   2  7   9 |  6   15    8 |
+-------------+------------+--------------+
|  16  7   16 |   9  5   8 |  3   24   24 |
|   8  4    9 |   3  2   7 |  5   16   16 |
|   2  5    3 |   4  6   1 |  8    9    7 |
+-------------+------------+--------------+

50 Advanced BUG-Light Elimination
3...1..59..762....1...4.......97...5..4....7..6....2.4.7......1..5..8.3..91......
+-------------+---------------+---------------+
|    3   4  2 |   8    1    7 |    6    5   9 |
|    9  58  7 |   6    2   35 |   14   14  38 |
|    1  58  6 |  35    4    9 |  378   28  27 |
+-------------+---------------+---------------+
|    2  13  8 |   9    7    4 |   13    6   5 |
|    5  13  4 |   2   68   16 |    9    7  38 |
|    7   6  9 |  35  358  135 |    2   18   4 |
+-------------+---------------+---------------+
|  *68   7  3 |   4  *56    2 |  *58    9   1 |
|   46   2  5 |   1    9    8 |   47    3  67 |
| *468   9  1 |   7 -356  356 | *458  248  26 |
+-------------+---------------+---------------+
(r9c5-5-r7c5, r7c5-8-r7c7, r7c7-6-r7c1, SL:r7c7=5=r9c7, SL:r7c1=8=r9c1): r79c15|r79c7 => r9c5<>6

52 Nice Loop: r4c4=6=r7c4=3=r7c6=9=r4c6~9~r4c4 => r4c4<>9
.....73...9...........16.583.....1..72.1...9........26.14.8.27....2.5.....97.....
+------------------+--------------------+--------------------+
|  1568   568  568 |  4589    259     7 |     3    146  1249 |
|  1568     9   37 |  3458    235  2348 |   467    146  1247 |
|     4    37    2 |    39      1     6 |    79      5     8 |
+------------------+--------------------+--------------------+
|     3  4568  568 |-45689  25679 *2489 |     1     48   457 |
|     7     2  568 |     1     56    48 |   458      9     3 |
|     9   458    1 |  3458    357   348 |  4578      2     6 |
+------------------+--------------------+--------------------+
|    56     1    4 |  *369      8   *39 |     2      7    59 |
|    68  3678   37 |     2    469     5 |  4689  13468   149 |
|     2  3568    9 |     7     46     1 |  4568   3468    45 |
+------------------+--------------------+--------------------+

52 Nice Loop: r4c7=1=r4c8-1-r9c8=1=r9c3=4=r4c3~4~r4c7 => r4c7<>4
.63.4...1.........129...8......38....17.....8..8...6....21..9..8..42..3.5....37..
+-----------------+----------------------+---------------------+
|     7    6    3 |      8     4     259 |    25    259      1 |
|     4    8    5 |  23679  1679   12679 |    23   2679  23679 |
|     1    2    9 |   3567   567     567 |     8   4567  34567 |
+-----------------+----------------------+---------------------+
|   269   45  *46 |  25679     3       8 | -1245 *12579   2579 |
|  2369    1    7 |   2569   569   24569 |  2345    259      8 |
|   239  345    8 |   2579  1579  124579 |     6   2579  23579 |
+-----------------+----------------------+---------------------+
|    36  347    2 |      1  5678     567 |     9    468     46 |
|     8   79   16 |      4     2      79 |    15      3     56 |
|     5   49 *146 |     69   689       3 |     7 *12468    246 |
+-----------------+----------------------+---------------------+

53 Nice Loop: r3c2=1=r6c2=7=r4c2-7-r4c9-6-r4c7=6=r3c7~6~r3c2 => r3c7<>1
6..1......5....9..7.3.....43..8...1..8.6..59...6...2...4...18......6.7.5..9..5...
+------------------+-----------------------+----------------+
|     6   29   248 |     1  245789   24789 |   3  2578  278 |
|  1248    5  1248 |  2347   23478  234678 |   9   278   16 |
|     7 *129     3 |   259    2589    2689 | -16   258    4 |
+------------------+-----------------------+----------------+
|     3  *27     5 |     8    2479    2479 | *46     1  *67 |
|   124    8   124 |     6    1237     237 |   5     9   37 |
|     9  *17     6 |  3457   13457     347 |   2  3478  378 |
+------------------+-----------------------+----------------+
|     5    4     7 |    23      23       1 |   8     6    9 |
|   128    3   128 |    49       6     489 |   7    24    5 |
|    28    6     9 |    47     478       5 |  14   234  123 |
+------------------+-----------------------+----------------+

53 Nice Loop: r1c1=2=r1c9=1=r3c9-1-r3c5-7-r2c5=7=r2c3~7~r1c1 => r2c3<>2
.69.3..8..1..........2...9..91.4..2.7.....4...2...9..7...7..91...3.5.........2..6
+---------------------+------------------+-------------------+
|   *245      6     9 |   145   3    145 |     7     8 *1245 |
|  23458      1 -24578|    69 *79   4568 |  2356  3456  2345 |
|   3458  34578  4578 |     2 *17  14568 |   356     9 *1345 |
+---------------------+------------------+-------------------+
|    356      9     1 |    35   4      7 |  3568     2   358 |
|      7    358   568 |  1358   2    135 |     4   356     9 |
|   3458      2   458 |   358   6      9 |     1    35     7 |
+---------------------+------------------+-------------------+
|     26     45    26 |     7   8     34 |     9     1   345 |
|     19    478     3 |    69   5     16 |    28    47   248 |
|     19   4578  4578 |    34  19      2 |   358  3457     6 |
+---------------------+------------------+-------------------+

58 ALS xz-rule (A=3 cells)
7..3...6.....1...4.3...52......649..9.61........8.......3.2..5.2......1..154...7.
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Postby RW » Sun Jun 25, 2006 10:50 am

Thank you Mike for the puzzles. I'll check them as soon as possible, but it may take some time until I find the required spare time.

RW
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Postby daj95376 » Sun Jun 25, 2006 4:23 pm

Mike Barker, A great collection.

FYI: In the following example, it should be noted that a Franken Swordfish isn't needed to solve the puzzle -- just Singles, a Pair, and an XY-Wing. (Or else I need to rewrite my XY-Wing logic!)

8...5..41......5...4.....6345.1......3.7.......12..6.512.3..4........7....3.9..2.
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Joined: 15 May 2006

Postby Mike Barker » Sun Jun 25, 2006 8:29 pm

Daj - you are right, my solver normally uses XY-wings after fish. I've moved XY-wings up in the technqiues order. Here's a replacement and a few more as well. I threw in some X-wings and XY-wings as well - may as well have as close to a complete set a possible.
Code: Select all
9 Finned X-wing
6..........7...64.....92.1...4..79...3..1.42.......1.6..32....5.4.5......2.......  Row
1..5.9....4.....788..3..9..7..8..4......6.1...62.7..3.4...5......7...35....1...8.  Row

10 Finned Swordfish
......6....569..7..2....5..3.9.....4....2.1.....4.7.....391..5..4..7...2..1..3.4.

11 Franken Swordfish
..8..7964..96...........7.......1.3.7..2.41...6.5.........5....5....2.83.463....7

10 Franken Swordfish (2 per puzzle)
...3..9.2..7..5..44...9..8....5.3798...........671....7..9..8.5.......2...52...4.

11 Franken Jellyfish
.1..3.......29.5.17.....49.4..3.1..6........4.3.9..72...9.6.8..5..4.........1.2..

19 Three Grouped Strong Links (Grouped Turbot Chain)
1.8.9.....6.......52.4....1.......14...9...8...3..6.9..816.2.......7..6.49..5...2

21 XY-wing
...82....7.34.6...5.......79......5..3.5....4...2.4.....9...38.26..7......4..12..
.......5.6.....91.4....9...2..8.16..3.1.6....8..5......2.....87.3..9.52....34....

46 UR+3N/2SL (8-node XY-chain)
........72..........379..1.4.6...25.....5........76..385.9.7....4....8.6...4.8.2.
Mike Barker
 
Posts: 458
Joined: 22 January 2006

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