Symmetric 18s

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re: Symmetric 18s

Postby Pat » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:17 am

Serg wrote:I've done 2 small investigations about horizontally symmetric 18-clue puzzles published in this thread (105 puzzles were published totally).

First, It is very wondering for me, but all 105 published puzzles have different patterns

not a surprise

this is a list of patterns,
not a list of puzzles
    eleven (2010.Aug.24) wrote:Totally i got 362 non equivalent symmetric puzzles.

      The most fruitful pattern seems to be #71 with 49 puzzles,
      followed by #77(24) and #79(20).
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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby Serg » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:26 am

Hi, Pat!
Thank you for your clarification. So, my "new" puzzles 106 and 107 are invalid. (I'll edit my post in a while.)

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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby olimpia » Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:28 am

I believe this is a new shape (#106):
Code: Select all
1 . . . . . . . 3
2 . . . . . . . 4
. . 7 8 . 4 6 . .
. . 6 . . . 9 . .
. . . . . . . . .
5 . . . 3 . . . 1
3 . . . . . . . 2
. . . . 1 . . . .
. . . 9 . 8 . . .

Code: Select all
1.......32.......4..78.46....6...9...........5...3...13.......2....1.......9.8...    #106 olimpia

But it's getting harder to find more new ones. I already have one PC running, and I'm going to see if I can install my search algorithm on my iPad. If nothing comes up in a decade or two i'll ask my doctor if my pacemaker and hearing aids have any spare cpu time that i can put to use also :roll:
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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby Serg » Wed Oct 05, 2011 8:07 pm

Hi, olimpia!
olimpia wrote:I believe this is a new shape (#106):
Code: Select all
1 . . . . . . . 3
2 . . . . . . . 4
. . 7 8 . 4 6 . .
. . 6 . . . 9 . .
. . . . . . . . .
5 . . . 3 . . . 1
3 . . . . . . . 2
. . . . 1 . . . .
. . . 9 . 8 . . .


What a nice cat face (or dog face?) you published! I confirm that you published new 18-clue symmetric pattern. (I checked it by gsf's "sudoku" tool.)
This project is very interesting for me. You've really posted a new 18-clue symmetric shape as you promised year ago. You are real hero - to work silently a year to find new result. Nice job!

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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby olimpia » Fri Oct 07, 2011 2:59 am

Thanks Serg,
some of my friends don't understand what I am doing when I work one year to make a sudoku. I tell them I am trying to make a new puzzle but then they laugh at me :cry:

Now I tell them I have a friend in Russia who likes my sudoku :)

Now, we all want to go to Russia in 2014 to see the Winter Olympics in Sochi! We hope to drink some vodka and play Sudoku too! :P
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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby Smythe Dakota » Fri Oct 07, 2011 8:07 am

olimpia wrote: .... Is there anyone willing to help find 3 more to make it an even 100 :roll: :?:

100 isn't so even in hexadecimal -- it's just 64.

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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby eleven » Thu Oct 20, 2011 9:52 am

Maybe something for olimpia's T-shirt. The deluxe version will come in time for the Christmas business :)
Hidden Text: Show
Image


[Added:]Here is a color version now (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/403/vs18color.jpg)
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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby Serg » Thu Oct 20, 2011 9:48 pm

Hi, eleven!
eleven wrote:Maybe something for olimpia's T-shirt. The deluxe version will come in time for the Christmas business :)
Hidden Text: Show
Image


[Added:]Here is a color version now (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/403/vs18color.jpg)
Hidden Text: Show
Image


Nice weaves! (Eskimo art.) I think it is better to put 2 empty patterns in the left top corner and right bottom corner (as you made in color version). What do you mean by placing black pattern having alone vertical empty column? I think this pattern is entry, but the last empty pattern is exit. Right?

Thanks, Serg
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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby ronk » Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:13 am

eleven wrote:Here is a color version now

If you've time on your hands :) , I'd be interested in seeing symmetry of the colors too.
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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby eleven » Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:59 pm

Serg, as you said, i thought its nicer with the free places top left and bottom right, Since i did not know, what to do with the first, i just showed the vertical mirror line, The empty sudoku is for olimpia (or whoever) to fill in the next finding.
Ron, dont know, what you mean, the colors refer to the digits in the original puzzles.

Since the picture as a whole looked rather chaotic, i tried to reorganize the patterns in order to group similar ones. This way some nice patterns were lost, but its more tempered now.
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/819/vs18colorb.jpg/

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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby ronk » Sat Oct 22, 2011 12:46 am

eleven wrote:Ron, dont know, what you mean, the colors refer to the digits in the original puzzles.

I mean, e.g., that clues at r3c2 and r3c8 would have the same color. Ditto for clues at r5c4 and r5c6. I think you would still need only 9 colors total, as you have now.
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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby eleven » Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:01 am

Ok, if you are not interested in the digits (to solve those mostly easy puzzles - "row 3 column 2 must be red"), but just want the colors to look more pretty, can you tell me, which colors to use where ?
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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby ronk » Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:39 am

eleven wrote:Ok, if you are not interested in the digits (to solve those mostly easy puzzles - "row 3 column 2 must be red"), but just want the colors to look more pretty, can you tell me, which colors to use where ?

One way: Color any clue positions in c5 black. Arrange your nine colors in rainbow order, e.g., red, orange, yellow, green, blue and violet, but make substitutions and insertions using your nine colors. Then scanning grid positions r1c1, r1c2, r1c3, r1c4, r2c1, r2c2 ... r9c3, r9c4, sequentially assign the 9 colors to the used clue positions. Color symmetric clue positions the same. The only time all 9 colors would be used is when there are no clues in c5.

As I write this, it's beginning to sound like a boon-doggle idea.
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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby olimpia » Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:56 am

Smythe Dakota wrote:100 isn't so even in hexadecimal -- it's just 64.

In Roman numerals 100 is expressed as "C". But I'm not sure how the ancient Romans expressed 100 in hexadecimal form. Probably the Romans didn't care about hexadecimal numbers.

eleven wrote:Maybe something for olimpia's T-shirt

That design is so very cool! I like it so much. I'm so glad someone finally took some sudokus and presented them with an artful method. And the design is truthful to the sudokus. The 9 colors represent the 9 digits, so the image contains the full working sudokus.

ronk wrote:I'd be interested in seeing symmetry of the colors too.

Please don't change the colors. If you make the colors symmetric then they aren't sudokus anymore. Two green dots in a single row would be like a sudoku with two of the same digit in a row. I think the way eleven presented the design is perfect. I just wish there was a way to send it into outer space and let it be discovered by some intelligent life on another planet. Then see if they send it back with a few more patterns added :shock: Such a cool design!
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Re: Symmetric 18s

Postby ronk » Sat Oct 22, 2011 3:23 am

olimpia wrote:
ronk wrote:I'd be interested in seeing symmetry of the colors too.

Please don't change the colors. If you make the colors symmetric then they aren't sudokus anymore. Two green dots in a single row would be like a sudoku with two of the same digit in a row.

Depends upon whether one sees them as a set of symmetric patterns with valid puzzles ... or as a set of puzzles, one for each symmetric pattern. I doubt that any of the puzzles are unique to their pattern, so I lean towards the former.
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