November 18, 2016

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November 18, 2016

Postby ArkieTech » Fri Nov 18, 2016 12:22 am

Code: Select all
 *-----------*
 |2..|.5.|..7|
 |.4.|1..|3..|
 |..9|.26|...|
 |---+---+---|
 |6.8|...|.7.|
 |92.|...|.14|
 |.7.|...|8.9|
 |---+---+---|
 |...|59.|7..|
 |..6|..3|.9.|
 |3..|.6.|..8|
 *-----------*


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dan
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Re: November 18, 2016

Postby Leren » Fri Nov 18, 2016 12:34 am

Code: Select all
*--------------------------------------------------------------*
| 2     6     1      | 3     5     48     | 9     48    7      |
| 578   4    e7-5    | 1     78    9      | 3     26    26     |
| 78    3     9      | 478   2     6      | 145   458   15     |
|--------------------+--------------------+--------------------|
| 6     15    8      | 9     134   1245   | 25    7     235    |
| 9     2    a35     | 78    378  b578    | 6     1     4      |
| 145   7     345    | 6     13    125    | 8     235   9      |
|--------------------+--------------------+--------------------|
| 14    18    2      | 5     9     148    | 7     36    36     |
| 1457  158   6      | 2478  1478  3      | 1245  9     125    |
| 3     9    d457    | 247   6    c147    | 1245  245   8      |
*--------------------------------------------------------------*

L2 Wing : (5) r5c3 = (5-7) r56 = r9c6 - r9c3 = (7) r2c3 => - 5 r2c3; stte

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Re: November 18, 2016

Postby SteveG48 » Fri Nov 18, 2016 1:00 am

Code: Select all
 *-----------------------------------------------------------*
 | 2     6     1     | 3     5    b48    | 9     48    7     |
 | 578   4    a57    | 1    a78    9     | 3     26    26    |
 | 78    3     9     | 478   2     6     | 145   458   15    |
 *-------------------+-------------------+-------------------|
 | 6    e15    8     | 9     134   1245  | 25    7     235   |
 | 9     2     3-5   | 78    378   578   | 6     1     4     |
 |e145   7     345   | 6     13    125   | 8     235   9     |
 *-------------------+-------------------+-------------------|
 |d14    18    2     | 5     9    c148   | 7     36    36    |
 | 1457  158   6     | 2478  1478  3     | 1245  9     125   |
 | 3     9     457   | 247   6     147   | 1245  245   8     |
 *-----------------------------------------------------------*


(5=78)r2c35 - (8=4)r1c6 - r7c6 = r7c1 - (4=15)b4p27 => -5 r5c3 ; stte
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Re: November 18, 2016

Postby Sudtyro2 » Fri Nov 18, 2016 9:46 pm

Code: Select all
 *-----------------------------------------------------------*
 | 2     6     1     | 3     5     48    | 9     48    7     |
 | 578   4    @57e   | 1     78    9     | 3     26    26    |
 | 8-7   3     9     |p478   2     6     | 145   458   15    |
 |-------------------+-------------------+-------------------|
 | 6     15    8     | 9     134   1245  | 25    7     235   |
 | 9     2     35d   | 78    378   578c  | 6     1     4     |
 | 145   7     345   | 6     13    125   | 8     235   9     |
 |-------------------+-------------------+-------------------|
 | 14    18    2     | 5     9     148   | 7     36    36    |
 | 1457  158   6     | 2478  1478  3     | 1245  9     125   |
 | 3     9    #457a  | 247   6     147b  | 1245  245   8     |
 *-----------------------------------------------------------*
In 7s, a finned Sashimi Kraken 1x1 Fish c3\r3 + fr2c3,rfr9c3 => -7r3c1.
Caution: Show
The "Sashimi 1-Fish" has a cover sector without any base candidates, so it's not really a fish per current UFG standards. However, the elimination logic does seem to work correctly. See here for detailed discussions.
p potential elimination
- eventual elimination
@ fin
# remote fin:
7r9c3 - r9c6 = (7-5)r5c6 = r5c3 - (5=7)r2c3 - 7r3c1; stte
It's curious that the remote-fin chain appears to be a contradiction, since both 7r9c3 and 7r2c3 are true in the chain. While starting with a false premise, the forcing chain still makes me nervous. Is this OK?

SteveC
Last edited by Sudtyro2 on Sun Sep 08, 2019 8:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: November 18, 2016

Postby SteveG48 » Fri Nov 18, 2016 11:48 pm

Sudtyro2 wrote:# remote fin:
7r9c3 - r9c6 = (7-5)r5c6 = r5c3 - (5=7)r2c3 - 7r3c1; stte
It's curious that the remote-fin chain appears to be a contradiction, since both 7r9c3 and 7r2c3 are true in the chain. While starting with a false premise, the forcing chain still makes me nervous. Is this OK?

SteveC


Sure it's ok. It just proves that 7 is not true at r9c3, and that supports the conclusion of your chain, via 7r2c3 or 7r8c1.
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Re: November 18, 2016

Postby Leren » Sat Nov 19, 2016 8:03 pm

Sudtyro2 wrote : 7r9c3 - r9c6 = (7-5)r5c6 = r5c3 - (5=7)r2c3 - 7r3c1; stte

Looks to me like you can ignore the fish altogether and just modify your fin chain a bit :

Code: Select all
*--------------------------------------------------------------*
| 2     6     1      | 3     5     48     | 9     48    7      |
| 58-7  4    f57     | 1     78    9      | 3     26    26     |
| 8-7   3     9      | 478   2     6      | 145   458   15     |
|--------------------+--------------------+--------------------|
| 6     15    8      | 9     134   1245   | 25    7     235    |
| 9     2    e35     | 78    378  d578    | 6     1     4      |
| 145   7     345    | 6     13    125    | 8     235   9      |
|--------------------+--------------------+--------------------|
| 14    18    2      | 5     9     148    | 7     36    36     |
|a1457  158   6      | 2478  1478  3      | 1245  9     125    |
| 3     9    b45-7   | 247   6    c147    | 1245  245   8      |
*--------------------------------------------------------------*

(7) r8c1 = r9c3 - r9c6 = (7-5)r5c6 = r5c3 - (5=7)r2c3 ; => - 7 r23c1, r9c3

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Re: November 18, 2016

Postby Sudtyro2 » Sat Nov 19, 2016 9:09 pm

Leren wrote:
Sudtyro2 wrote : 7r9c3 - r9c6 = (7-5)r5c6 = r5c3 - (5=7)r2c3 - 7r3c1; stte

Looks to me like you can ignore the fish altogether and just modify your fin chain a bit :

Code: Select all
*--------------------------------------------------------------*
| 2     6     1      | 3     5     48     | 9     48    7      |
| 58-7  4    f57     | 1     78    9      | 3     26    26     |
| 8-7   3     9      | 478   2     6      | 145   458   15     |
|--------------------+--------------------+--------------------|
| 6     15    8      | 9     134   1245   | 25    7     235    |
| 9     2    e35     | 78    378  d578    | 6     1     4      |
| 145   7     345    | 6     13    125    | 8     235   9      |
|--------------------+--------------------+--------------------|
| 14    18    2      | 5     9     148    | 7     36    36     |
|a1457  158   6      | 2478  1478  3      | 1245  9     125    |
| 3     9    b45-7   | 247   6    c147    | 1245  245   8      |
*--------------------------------------------------------------*

(7) r8c1 = r9c3 - r9c6 = (7-5)r5c6 = r5c3 - (5=7)r2c3 ; => - 7 r23c1, r9c3
Leren

You're absolutely right...
The original forcing chain would also be half of a Kraken column (7)c3, which places 7r2c3 and would provide those additional eliminations (all peers of 7r2c3)!

The forcing chain is also key to an easy 5-link Oddagon: 7r38c1,r28c5,r3c4 having three guardians, one of which (7r8c4) uses the chain.

It often occurs that three seemingly different patterns are common to the same elimination: Oddagon, Kraken column, and 1x1 Fish. I can usually spot the two others after first finding the Oddagon.

SteveC
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