Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

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Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby ArkieTech » Wed Nov 27, 2013 12:16 am

Code: Select all
 *-----------*
 |.7.|6..|..1|
 |..2|..4|9..|
 |..1|98.|...|
 |---+---+---|
 |2.5|...|.6.|
 |.6.|.7.|.9.|
 |.9.|...|2.4|
 |---+---+---|
 |...|.45|3..|
 |..4|7..|1..|
 |7..|..3|.2.|
 *-----------*


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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby JC Van Hay » Wed Nov 27, 2013 2:02 am

"Basics" ... :)
Code: Select all
+------------------+-------------+-------------------+
| 359(8)  7    389 | 6   35   2  | 5(8)  4      1    |
| 6       358  2   | 35  1    4  | 9     35(8)  7    |
| 35      4    1   | 9   8    7  | 6     35     2    |
+------------------+-------------+-------------------+
| 2       1    5   | 4   39   89 | 7     6      38   |
| 4       6    3-8 | 2   7    1  | 5(8)  9      358  |
| 3(8)    9    7   | 35  356  68 | 2     1      4    |
+------------------+-------------+-------------------+
| 1       2    69  | 8   4    5  | 3     7      69   |
| 359(8)  358  4   | 7   2    69 | 1     5(8)   5689 |
| 7       58   689 | 1   69   3  | 4     2      5689 |
+------------------+-------------+-------------------+
Swordfish(8C178) : r6c1=Skyscraper(C18)-r1c7=r5c7 :=> -8r5c3; ste
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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby Leren » Wed Nov 27, 2013 4:27 am

Code: Select all
*-----------------------------------------------------------------------*
|g3589   7     l389     | 6      35     2       |kd58     4      1      |
| 6     f358    2       | 35     1      4       |  9    je358    7      |
| 35     4      1       | 9      8      7       |  6      35     2      |
|-----------------------+-----------------------+-----------------------|
| 2      1      5       | 4      39     89      |  7      6      38     |
| 4      6     b3-8     | 2      7      1       | c58     9      358    |
|a38     9      7       | 35     356    68      |  2      1      4      |
|-----------------------+-----------------------+-----------------------|
| 1      2      69      | 8      4      5       |  3      7      69     |
|h3589   358    4       | 7      2      69      |  1     i58     5689   |
| 7      58     689     | 1      69     3       |  4      2      5689   |
*-----------------------------------------------------------------------*

X Chain with memory: (8) r6c1 = r5c3 - r5c7 = r1c7 - r2c8 = r2c2 - r1c1 *=* r8c1 - r8c8 = r2c8 - r1c7 *=* r1c3 => - 8 r5c3; stte

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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby ArkieTech » Wed Nov 27, 2013 10:40 am

Code: Select all
 
 *-----------------------------------------------------------*
 | 3589  7     389   | 6     35    2     | 58    4     1     |
 | 6    *358   2     | 35    1     4     | 9    *358   7     |
 | 35    4     1     | 9     8     7     | 6     35    2     |
 |-------------------+-------------------+-------------------|
 | 2     1     5     | 4     39    89    | 7     6     3-8   |
 | 4     6    *38    | 2     7     1     |f58    9    *358   |
 | 38    9     7     | 35    356   68    | 2     1     4     |
 |-------------------+-------------------+-------------------|
 | 1     2     69    | 8     4     5     | 3     7     69    |
 | 3589  358   4     | 7     2     69    | 1    *58   *5689  |
 | 7    *58   *689   | 1     69    3     | 4     2    f5689  |
 *-----------------------------------------------------------*
Finned Franken Jellyfish
8r259b9c2389 fr5c7 fr9c9 => -8r4c9
Last edited by ArkieTech on Wed Nov 27, 2013 11:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby Leren » Wed Nov 27, 2013 11:18 am

Hi Dan, a minor typo in your PM - change r5c7 label from * to f

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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby tlanglet » Wed Nov 27, 2013 2:39 pm

Took me a while to find a solution with most attempts winding through the same useless logic......

Code: Select all
 *-----------------------------------------------------------*
 |*3589  7     389   | 6     35    2     |*58    4     1     |
 | 6     358   2     | 35    1     4     | 9     358   7     |
 | 35    4     1     | 9     8     7     | 6     35    2     |
 |-------------------+-------------------+-------------------|
 | 2     1     5     | 4     39    89    | 7     6    d38    |
 | 4     6     3-8   | 2     7     1     |*e58   9    d358   |
 |*38    9     7     | 35    356   68    | 2     1     4     |
 |-------------------+-------------------+-------------------|
 | 1     2     69    | 8     4     5     | 3     7     69    |
 |a3589  358   4     | 7     2     69    | 1    b58   b5689  |
 | 7     58    689   | 1     69    3     | 4     2    c5689  |
 *-----------------------------------------------------------*

Almost skyscraper (8) with base in r1 and towers in c17 with almost digit 8r8c1
[skyscraper(8) => r5c3<>8] = [8r8c1-r8c89=r9c9-r45c9=r5c7 => r5c3<>8] => r5c3<>8
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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby Marty R. » Wed Nov 27, 2013 4:52 pm

Code: Select all
+--------------+-----------+-------------+
| 3589 7   389 | 6  35  2  | 58 4   1    |
| 6    358 2   | 35 1   4  | 9  358 7    |
| 35   4   1   | 9  8   7  | 6  35  2    |
+--------------+-----------+-------------+
| 2    1   5   | 4  39  89 | 7  6   38   |
| 4    6   38  | 2  7   1  | 58 9   358  |
| 38   9   7   | 35 356 68 | 2  1   4    |
+--------------+-----------+-------------+
| 1    2   69  | 8  4   5  | 3  7   69   |
| 3589 358 4   | 7  2   69 | 1  58  5689 |
| 7    58  689 | 1  69  3  | 4  2   5689 |
+--------------+-----------+-------------+

Play this puzzle online at the Daily Sudoku site

No fancy terminology.

(8=3)r6c1-(3=8)r5c3-r5c7=r1c7*-r2c8=r8c8=>r18c1<>8

(I put an asterisk in the 4th term to indicate that makes the first deletion before the transport).
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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby daj95376 » Wed Nov 27, 2013 6:10 pm

Although there are several Jellyfish for r4c9<>8 and r5c3<>8, there were several posts for r5c3<>8 found by various other means. Also, there is a coloring approach once used by Angus Johnson (before he dropped it from his scenarios). Here, Green is assumed to be false and Blue is assumed to be true.

Code: Select all
 r5c7=G, r1c7=B, r2c8=G, r8c8=B
         r1c1=G          r8c1=G -> r6c1=B                (scenario AJ dropped)

 r5c7=G                            r6c1=B  =>  r5c3<>8
 +--------------------------------------------------------------+
 | G3589  7     389   |  6     35    2     | B58    4     1     |
 |  6     358   2     |  35    1     4     |  9    G358   7     |
 |  35    4     1     |  9     8     7     |  6     35    2     |
 |--------------------+--------------------+--------------------|
 |  2     1     5     |  4     39    89    |  7     6     38    |
 |  4     6     38    |  2     7     1     | G58    9     358   |
 | B38    9     7     |  35    356   68    |  2     1     4     |
 |--------------------+--------------------+--------------------|
 |  1     2     69    |  8     4     5     |  3     7     69    |
 | G3589  358   4     |  7     2     69    |  1    B58    5689  |
 |  7     58    689   |  1     69    3     |  4     2     5689  |
 +--------------------------------------------------------------+
 # 45 eliminations remain

However, AJ's pattern is now more likely to be replaced by an oddagon with guardian cells.

Code: Select all
 r1c3                      - r5c3
 r6c1                      - r5c3
 r7c29-r7c8=r2c8-r1c7=r5c7 - r5c3
 +--------------------------------------------------------------+
 | *3589  7    g389   |  6     35    2     | *58    4     1     |
 |  6     358   2     |  35    1     4     |  9    *358   7     |
 |  35    4     1     |  9     8     7     |  6     35    2     |
 |--------------------+--------------------+--------------------|
 |  2     1     5     |  4     39    89    |  7     6     38    |
 |  4     6     38    |  2     7     1     |  58    9     358   |
 | g38    9     7     |  35    356   68    |  2     1     4     |
 |--------------------+--------------------+--------------------|
 |  1     2     69    |  8     4     5     |  3     7     69    |
 | *3589 g358   4     |  7     2     69    |  1    *58   g5689  |
 |  7     58    689   |  1     69    3     |  4     2     5689  |
 +--------------------------------------------------------------+
 # 45 eliminations remain
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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby SteveG48 » Wed Nov 27, 2013 10:50 pm

Multi-colors on 8: Chain 1: r8c8-r2c8-r1c7-r5c7
Chain 2: r5c3-r6c1 => r1c1,r8c1 <> 8 => r6c1=8; stte
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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby Leren » Thu Nov 28, 2013 1:32 am

SteveG48 wrote:Multi-colors on 8: Chain 1: r8c8-r2c8-r1c7-r5c7
Chain 2: r5c3-r6c1 => r1c1,r8c1 <> 8 => r6c1=8; stte

Still trying to understand what you are saying here. Did You mean ?

Code: Select all
(8) r8c8 = r2c8 - r1c7 = r5c7 - r5c3 = r6c1 => - 8 r8c1;
                   ||
                       = r5c7 - r5c3 = r6c1 => - 8 r1c1; stte

Leren

<Edit> Fixed typo in lower chain spotted by SteveG48
Last edited by Leren on Thu Nov 28, 2013 3:14 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby SteveG48 » Thu Nov 28, 2013 2:00 am

Leren wrote:
SteveG48 wrote:Multi-colors on 8: Chain 1: r8c8-r2c8-r1c7-r5c7
Chain 2: r5c3-r6c1 => r1c1,r8c1 <> 8 => r6c1=8; stte

Still trying to understand what you are saying here. Did You mean ?

Code: Select all
(8) r8c8 = r2c8 - r1c7 = r5c7 - r5c3 = r6c1 => - 8 r8c1;
                   ||
                       = r5c7 - r5c3 = r6c1 => - 1 r8c1; stte

Leren


No, you're deleting 1 and 8 from r8c1. I'm deleting 8 from both r1c1 and r8c1 using multi-colors on 8. r5c3 and r5c7 are in the same row. r6c1 is the opposite "color" from r5c3. r1c7 and r8c8 are each opposite colors from r5c7. Therefore, r1c7/r6c1 delete the 8 from r1c1 and r8c8/r6c1 delete the 8 from r8c1. Maybe this diagram says it right:
Code: Select all
.----------------.-------------.---------------.
| 3589  7    389 | 6   35   2  | blu 4    1    |
| 6     358  2   | 35  1    4  | 9   red  7    |
| 35    4    1   | 9   8    7  | 6   35   2    |
:----------------+-------------+---------------:
| 2     1    5   | 4   39   89 | 7   6    38   |
| 4     6    grn | 2   7    1  | red 9    358  |
| brn   9    7   | 35  356  68 | 2   1    4    |
:----------------+-------------+---------------:
| 1     2    69  | 8   4    5  | 3   7    69   |
| 3589  358  4   | 7   2    69 | 1  blu   5689 |
| 7     58   689 | 1   69   3  | 4   2    5689 |
'----------------'-------------'---------------'


Green and red are on the same row. Targets that see both blue and brown exclude 8. Sorry I'm so bad with the notation.

I probably should have written chain 1 in the opposite order.
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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby Leren » Thu Nov 28, 2013 3:49 am

SteveG8 wrote: No, you're deleting 1 and 8 from r8c1.

Actually I was deleting 8 from r18c8 but you caught me out in one of my dyslexic moments - I've edited my post to fix the typo.

What I was trying to decide was whether your first post was one move or two. It's definitely one move. What you have shown is that if (1) r8c8 <> 8 then r6c1 = 8 so r18c1 <> 8; and (2) If r8c8 = 8 then r8c1 <> 8 but also r1c7 = 8 so r1c1 <> 8.

You could possibly write this as (8) r8c8 = r2c8 - r1c7 = r5c7 - r5c3 = r6c1 => - 8 r18c1; The underlining indicates that the second elimination also follows from the assumptions of the conditions in r8c8.

Much neater than my convoluted memory chain - well done !

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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby SteveG48 » Thu Nov 28, 2013 4:04 am

Leren wrote:Much neater than my convoluted memory chain - well done !

Leren


Thanks, Leren. What I can't figure out is how you spot those chains at all- and so fast! But what happened to your Finned Franken Jellyfish? That's another one that I wouldn't spot in the days that I have left on the planet.
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Re: Dan's Different Do November 27, 2013

Postby Leren » Thu Nov 28, 2013 6:14 am

StveG48 wrote: But what happened to your Finned Franken Jellyfish?

It was hiding in a school of undersized fish :x . I now have a special lure that only attracts fish that will solve a cell - so I can now replicate Dan's solution ;) .

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